SIGforum.com Main Page The Lounge Career Limiting Move for the CO of the Roosevelt? (Navy Peeps will Understand)
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You mean a Navy Hospital Ship helping Sailors and civilian hospitals helping civilians? Mind blown | |||
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| Lead slingin' Parrot Head  |
Without knowing all the details I won't pass judgement on Capt. Crozier at this point...except to say that sometimes decisions can have both good and bad consequences and that a good leader weighs both, makes a decision...and lives with it. It's apparent though that he had the respect of many on his crew. Link to original video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxtA5uibpxA | |||
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| Member |
Several videos embedded in the link. Quite the send-off for the Captain, not sure I've ever heard of such a response from the crew COVID-19 Plagued Aircraft Carrier Crew Give Sacked Captain A Thunderous Hero's Farewell | |||
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| Go ahead punk, make my day |
And besides, he's an O-6 >24-26 years of service, gonna pull down nearly 6-figures in retirement pay and get a 6-figure consulting job before he's off terminal leave. Looks like he's going out with the respect of his crew and knowing Big Navy, they were likely incompetent as fuck in dealing with the issue - as they often are with pretty much everything. | |||
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| Member |
Considering past issues...Fat Leonard, ship collisions, NCIS investigation, ship & air planning, etc, Big Navy has demonstrated little very little ability to correct & resolve challenges in a timely and prompt manner. Bureaucrats don't like to be called out and exposed, Crozier did just that. Next step is what did (or didn't) CSG Cdr and PacFlt do to deal with this...as there's no book. Their plan appears to have been "do nothing". | |||
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Needs a bigger boat |
https://www.navy.mil/submit/di....asp?story_id=112537 Link to SECNAV’s statement. If this is even 1/2 true CAPT Crozier was way out of line and needed to be relieved. Maybe the media hysteria about KungFlu got to him. I know for a fact the navy has plans in place to deal with a pandemic infection aboard a carrier. Looking at the demographics of a carrier crew and the characteristics of people most at risk of this virus, my gut tells me that big navy probably didn’t want to publicly take a “national strategic asset” off the board for something likely to not be much worse than the flu given the ages and lack of comorbidities of the crew. CAPT Crozier obviously disagreed. Publicly. Outside the proper channels and chain of command. He really left his superiors no choice but to relieve him. MOO means NO! Be the comet! | |||
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The Unmanned Writer |
WTF?!?!?! Does anyone else see a hint of common sense in there? Are sailors and civilians immune or noncontagious thereby not needing to do social distancing? Life moves pretty fast. If you don't stop and look around once in a while, you could miss it. "If dogs don't go to Heaven, I want to go where they go" Will Rogers | |||
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| The Unmanned Writer |
Judging by the social distancing being practiced, those sailors and civilians must be drinking from the cup of immunity. Those pics do not seem up to date otherwise. Life moves pretty fast. If you don't stop and look around once in a while, you could miss it. "If dogs don't go to Heaven, I want to go where they go" Will Rogers | |||
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| Member |
Yup, he was probably ready to go, and at least he can leave with his head held high. I seriously doubt this guy would have did what he did, again not leak this but distribute his letter on an unsecured channel, without the situation being rather dire. How anyone could trust "Big Navy" to properly deal with this is beyond me. | |||
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| Member |
Its a Navy ship, there's no such thing as social distancing, the mess decks are cramped and the birthing areas you're on top of each other, not to mention the ladders & passageways. Consider they've been on WestPac since January, I would wager the vast majority of the crew have no idea what social distancing is up until a day ago and most of them are viewing that practice thru a massively cynical lens. I'm picturing a scene from Footloose and a bunch of chiefs playing the teachers.  If anything they're in the midst of getting whatever work done before off-loading. Hell, if the air wing hasn't been off-loaded, that presents a whole other series of issues when ops resume. | |||
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| Member |
Being the custodian of 5,000 lives is not an easy burden. I am pretty certain he weighed his words carefully. To me, he's a patriot who suffered consequences bestowed by uninformed,non-combat experienced, intellectually lazy buffoons. His send off by his crew says a lot about his character. | |||
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| Needs a bigger boat |
I think it says much more about his popularity than it does about his character. Did you read SECNAV’s statement? I don’t know him beyond having spoken on BTB a few times. He certainly seemed nice enough, and TR’s bridge team had their shit together. He knew better. I’m curious to see what comes out down the road. I currently have a former O-6 who was relieved of a CG command working for me. There isn’t any tolerance for errors at that level, of judgement or any other kind. MOO means NO! Be the comet! | |||
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| No double standards |
Makes sense to me. "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women. When it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it....While it lies there, it needs no constitution, no law, no court to save it" - Judge Learned Hand, May 1944 | |||
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| Little ray of sunshine  |
I do not know enough to determine if he was justified in this extreme step, or if there were other options at his disposal that might have accomplished his goals. Sometimes your own convictions demand that you resign (and functionally that is what he did) your post noisily to achieve something you feel is important enough to sacrifice your own career. Now, it may be this would never be justified - if for example, it involved creating a real, acute risk to national security. I don't know enough to evaluate any of that here. I can't judge him. The fish is mute, expressionless. The fish doesn't think because the fish knows everything. | |||
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Member |
Reading the SECNAV's letter, one thing really piqued my interest: "The next day, I spoke with the CO of the THEODORE ROOSEVELT myself, and this morning, I have spoken to the TR’s Carrier Strike Group Commander, RDML Stuart Baker. RDML Baker did not know about the letter before it was sent to him via email by the CO. It is important to understand that the Strike Group Commander, the CO’s immediate boss, is embarked on the Theodore Roosevelt, right down the passageway from him. The letter was sent over non- secure, unclassified email even though that ship possesses some of the most sophisticated communications and encryption equipment in the Fleet." "...directed the Vice Chief of Naval Operations, Admiral Robert Burke, to conduct an investigation into the circumstances ..." I would love to know why Cpt. Crozier did not bother to send the letter ahead of time to his immediate boss, who was literally down the hall from him. If I were ADM Burke, my first question would be to ask Cpt. Crozier why was there not better communication with RDML Baker. This space intentionally left blank. | |||
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| Go ahead punk, make my day |
^^^^^ Great question, but perhaps the TR CSG Commander was the issue? Or his staff? Hard to know. I imagine their professional relationship wasn't great, if it came to this. And as a junior of the two, it was always going to work out poorly for the TR Capt. But the TR CSG Commander has some serious egg on his face as well. | |||
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Now in Florida |
Not a military guy and not knowledgeable about the chain of command issues involved, but there doesn't appear to be any doubt that this captain had the respect of the sailors under his command. | |||
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| No double standards |
You make sense. And it might be that both had legit gripes. But the Captain could have/should have handled it in a better way than to effectively go public. "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women. When it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it....While it lies there, it needs no constitution, no law, no court to save it" - Judge Learned Hand, May 1944 | |||
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| Member |
Nah- He let his men down because he didn't do what he expects them to do= Use the chain of command. It's a tough job. Few can shoulder the responsibility. People do die serving our country. It's good we found out he wasn't suited for that responsibility now instead of when the shit hits the fan. ____________________________________________________ The butcher with the sharpest knife has the warmest heart. | |||
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Member |
I was just talking to a retired Navy friend of mine. He stated the captain would’ve absolutely knew better than to send an email copying 30 people. When someone obviously leaked it, that sends the message to adversaries that the ship was possibly not combat ready. He was happy he was relieved. ——————————————— The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. Psalm 14:1 | |||
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SIGforum.com Main Page The Lounge Career Limiting Move for the CO of the Roosevelt? (Navy Peeps will Understand)
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