I have to admit the British have a knack for naming regiments. It is certainly more colorful than using numbers. Names such as the Bengal Lancers, the Fusiliers, Dragooons. When and how did this originate? I am curious if these names come naturally to the average British soldier, such as the names of the states in the United States?

The regimental names are very historical and often stem from things like what weapons systems they were equipped with when formed ( fusiliers for those issued muskets, lancers for lances dragoon’s were a form of heavily armed cavalry and so on) and regions they may have been recruited from or an area they served with distinction in. They usually have associated unit number designations as well. The American military predominantly uses a number system and the regimental histories are a bit different as the British use a strict regimental system while the US has changed to a battalion/ brigade based system. despite this the historical regimental histories and names are still attached to modern battalions. For example I served in a cav squadron that was the second squadron ( a battalion sized formation) of the 101st cavalry regiment. The regiment exists more on paper as a historical artifact than an actual formation of troops

Captain127 is absoluely correct. Say, in the Indian Army, infantry regiments are named after the ethnic group the regiment , or the area the men are recruited from. LIke for example, the Madras Regiment which recruits from all the South Indian States. Ethnic group, say the Rajput Regiment or the Rajputana Rifles, or the Gurkha Rifles. The Armoured Regiments do have some names that are from thee colonial days, say, like the Poona Horse, or the 12th Lancers, or the 61st Cavalry.

History and tradition - an unbeatable combination.

I live in East Anglia - the sticky-out bit of England on the Eastern side, home to -

The Royal Anglian Regiment, which was made up of the former

Royal Norfolk Regiment.

The Royal Suffolk Regiment.

All infantry, of course.

Dragoons, BTW, were not cavalry, but mounted infantry who mostly fought after they got off their horses, although my grandfather, in the 6th Dragoon Guards, could call himself cavalry.

The Light Infantry was formed during the Napoleonic wars as skirmishers, and, armed with the Baker rifle, waged carnage among the French and their allies in the Peninsular Wars - 'Sharpe of the 95th' wasn't real but he could have been. They later became -

The Durham Light Infantry and The Kings Own Shropshire Light Infantry and others - now simply called The Rifles.

The largest infantry regiment in the British Army is the Royal Irish, almost twice the size by numbers of any other, and made up of the Ulster Rifles and the Royal Irish Rangers.

Regiments are made up of battalions, often fiercely competitive even among themselves, and the cause of many broken noses and black eyes.

If you really want to see the British Army as it was, look at the ORBAT for 1914 or 1939.

BTW, the habit of recruiting from local towns and cities where the barracks was based resulted in some interesting demographics, not least of which were the huge casualty lists of men who had gone to school together and then to work together, like the so-called Pals Battalions of WW!. The first day of the Somme emptied whole streets of men back in England, Wales, Scotland and Ireland.

If you have a read of 'The Bedford Boys' - the story of one small Virginia township's awful D-Day, with many of its sons killed in action, you will get some idea of what it was like here in UK on 1st July 1916, when 19240 men died before lunch, 53733 were injured, some of them never to return to health, let alone the front line, and over 3700 disappeared without leaving any trace that they had ever existed at all.

One particular regiment, raised in Newfoundland DoC, had a particularly bad 'first day of the Somme'. They went into action at Thiepval and Beaumont Hamel at 0630 - all 780 of them, and by ten o'clock that morning there were about 80 of them left for roll-call. None of the survivors were officers, BTW.

One village here in England, with less than a thousand inhabitants, has 182 names on the WW1 memorial sides, and another 73 on the WW2 side, and yet another eleven added since then. Fathers and sons and brothers were popular combinations for the Reaper in those days.

The village in which I live, with a population in 1914 of less than hundred men, women and children, has 17 names on the WW1 memorial, most of them related.

tac

I also like that the Brits named one of their warships after their mother in law

HMS Battleaxe

I thought that was a nice touch for the sailors

Thanks tacfoley. I have always been interested in history. Recently viewed the Bengal Lancers a flim from the 1930s which got me to thinking.

The website for the Fusiliers is very informative and done well. It shows all the weapon systems they use. I have not looked at what the US Army has for a website, but this was done well with written material and pictures.

Here is the link for those interested:

https://www.army.mod.uk/who-we...giment-of-fusiliers/

Because the uniform of the RRF includes the wearing of a red and white hackle on the side of the beret, the other infantry regiments call them 'circus ponies'.

And because of the fact that in days of yore, many of those who enlisted in the East Anglian regiments were farmers, they were called hayseeds. It is said that because many did not know their left from their right feet, they had a bit of hay stuffed in one boot, and a bit of straw in the other, and called out hay, straw, hay, straw instead of left, right.

Infantry call the cavalry 'donkey wallopers', and so on.

Many traditions in the Army go back to the days of fighting the North America, either in the Revolutionary War, or the War of 1812.

Some are even earlier, like the Kings Own Rocket Troop of the Royal Artillery helping out the King of Sweden in one of the battles of the Seven Year's War - Leipzig. He was so pleased with them that he offered himself as their Colonel-in-Chief, and even today their loyal toast is to King Carl Gustav of Sweden, and THEN to HM the Queen. They got rather less fame, but everlasting notoriety, by providing the rockets, which, with their 'red glare', bombarded Washington during the War of 1812.

tac

Tac:

Is the Royal Air Force Regiment considered part of the RAF or British Army as they are basically an Army-ish infantry and air defense artillery unit assigned to the RAF and I don’t think the RAF uses that term “regiment” anywhere else?

quote:

Originally posted by PASig:
Tac:

Is the Royal Air Force Regiment considered part of the RAF or British Army as they are basically an Army-ish infantry and air defense artillery unit assigned to the RAF and I don’t think the RAF uses that term “regiment” anywhere else?

The RAF Regiment is part of the Royal Air Force and is nothing to do with the Army. Their primary role is airfield defence, hence they look like infantry. they did do a lot of patrolling in 'stan, and earned some top-quality gongs doing it. Great bunch of folks who think that they are an élite force. Can't blame them for the esprit de corps, right?

And you're right, they are the only bit of the RAF called 'Regiment'. They are, however, like cavalry, arranged in squadrons.

tac

Tac,

I went to the Royal Museum of the Armed Forces in Brussels. It's a very interesting museum especially for The Imperial Era and WW1.

One of the most sobering displays is a large glass enclosure from floor to ceiling, stacked with drums. When I listened to the audio tour it said that each drum was from a regiment that was for all intents and purposes wiped out on that very first day of the Battle of the Somme. There were a lot of drums.

I’m trying to find out what group my great grandfather was in and info about him. He was a British artillery officer, in the late 1800s, assigned in India to Allahabad I believe. I found a reference to an artillery fort in Allahabad. I think that must be the place as my grandmother was born in a brit fort in Allahabad. Her mother was the daughter of a Brit army couple in India who met and married my GGF in India.

Ant idea where I can look up mt great GF’s info?

quote:

BTW, the habit of recruiting from local towns and cities where the barracks was based resulted in some interesting demographics, not least of which were the huge casualty lists of men who had gone to school together and then to work together, like the so-called Pals Battalions of WW!. The first day of the Somme emptied whole streets of men back in England, Wales, Scotland and Ireland.

It gives one pause that neither the American, British, or British Dominion Armies learned from WWI.

YOU NEVER CREATE UNITS FROM THE SAME GEOGRAPHIC LOCATION.

If you do, you will inevitably create casualty lists where an unsustainable number of deaths in combat are from the same place back home.

America finally got the message after the Sullivan brothers perished on USS Juneau in 1942, yet still had the Niland brothers, the basis for Saving Private Ryan.

quote:

Originally posted by Sig2340:
It gives one pause that neither the American, British, or British Dominion Armies learned from WWI.

YOU NEVER CREATE UNITS FROM THE SAME GEOGRAPHIC LOCATION.

If you do, you will inevitably create casualty lists where an unsustainable number of deaths in combat are from the same place back home.

America finally got the message after the Sullivan brothers perished on USS Juneau in 1942, yet still had the Niland brothers, the basis for Saving Private Ryan.

The US military may have certain prohibitions against siblings serving together now, but some units are still comprised of men from relatively small geographical locations. Namely National Guard units.

Take the "Bedford Boys" of WW2 Normandy fame (as mentioned by tacfoley earlier in this thread). The town of Bedford, VA suffered a disproportionate number of casualties on D-Day, because they were a small town that had a relatively large number of guys all serving in the 116th Infantry Regiment of the 29th Infantry Division, which was among the first units to land on Omaha Beach.

That was because the 29th Infantry Division started out as a National Guard unit, comprised of National Guard regiments drawing from Virginia, Maryland, and New Jersey. The 116th was from the Virginia National Guard, so naturally, when it was activated and sent to fight in Europe, nearly all the men in the 116th were from the same part of Virginia.

Even today, National Guard units are by necessity drawn from a small geographic area. And when National Guard units are activated into federal service and sent into combat, any heavy losses to these National Guard units will still cause disproportionate casualties in that small area back home.

While I served in Iraq a company from the 258 infantry brigade of Louisiana was attached to our battalion. This company was called the “blacksheep” and was from a small town called Houma. During out tour 8 troops fromthat company made the ultimate sacrifice and in such a small town the loss was devastating. Everyone in that town could count a relative lost.

quote:

Originally posted by maxdog:
I’m trying to find out what group my great grandfather was in and info about him. He was a British artillery officer, in the late 1800s, assigned in India to Allahabad I believe. I found a reference to an artillery fort in Allahabad. I think that must be the place as my grandmother was born in a brit fort in Allahabad. Her mother was the daughter of a Brit army couple in India who met and married my GGF in India.

Ant idea where I can look up mt great GF’s info?

Ancestry.com is your friend, or, better yet, befriend somebody who works for the LDS ancestry records branch.

tac

Maxdog :I am LDS, and can help you find something about family that you want to. Please contact me if you want to go the LDS route. My email is in my profile.

The town of Bedford lost 22 men out of a population of 3,200. If the same ratio was applied to NYC the casualties would be on the order of 55,000.

The Bedford boys.

By the same reckoning as the WW2 losses of 73 ex 1000 of my own village here, Bedford would be mourning the loss of 233 of its young men.

tac