I personally would be a bit worried about the sub. A friend had one. Used oil like crazy. And theirs is not the only one. While people want to rave about them. Not just in this thread. I have reservations.

In this case I would go Mazda.

Out of the two I have questions more about the sub and why it is being resold after such a sort period of time more so than the Mazda.

I thought they got the oil issued worked out post 2014 cvt foresters, but youre right, there still seems to be quite a few reports of 15s and 16s guilty of it. Checked out some stuff in sub forum, looks like if the 2015 was manufactured in the first half of 2014 it might still have the short block problem.

I've done some research on the Subaru on and off over the years. Be mindful of a potential issue with head gasket leaks on the 2.5 engine in the Subaru. Not as much as an issue in the 2.0 turbo charged or 3.6 6cyl engine.

Also note that with an AWD vehicle there are certain restrictions on how the car is towed (all 4 wheels must be off the ground). IIRC also, if there is one damaged tire, then all 4 must be replaced... I think so on that one.

Over all the Mazda will likely be ever so slightly more reliable and cheaper to maintain overall.

quote:

Originally posted by muddle_mann:

Also note that with an AWD vehicle there are certain restrictions on how the car is towed (all 4 wheels must be off the ground). IIRC also, if there is one damaged tire, then all 4 must be replaced... I think so on that one.

Correct, Subaru's AWD system likes all 4 tires to be roughly the same rolling circumference.

A 5th wheel used as a full sized spare that is regularly rotated in with the other 4 tires works as a hedge against having to buy a whole new set of 4 if you damage a tire beyond repair.

I'm at 120k miles on my Outback using the 5 tire rotation method with rotation intervals at 5k.

But yes, towing an Automatic of CVT Subaru means flat bed only. A manual transmission Subaru can be towed on a flat bed or with all 4 wheels on the ground--never two on the ground or two on a dolly.

So heres an update:
Ive decided to buy new, I can get better deals right now on 2018 models vs used by going through Internet sales managers (typically 13% below msrp).
Test drove the new Outback and Forester. I liked both. Most reviews have it pretty spot on. Spent alot of time lurking on forester and outback forums to get inside info. For the most part no major issues with 2016+ models as far as engines go.

Outback pros: great climate control system, handels well, very stable and smooth driving, nicer materials, better seats front and back (rear legroom is almost the same but it feels more spacious in the outback), quiet inside, regular 2.5 engine is sufficient for everyday use and normal highway operations (I was expecting it to be a turd but I think it was better that my wifes 2015 Toyota Sienna). Cons- unconventional styling, overly complicated infotainment system- major reported problems popping up with it, reported bad fuel gauge readings and paint issues. Also, because it was so tame and well behaved on the road it was rather boring to drive as an everyday car (offroad would be different of course, feels like it would handle it fine).

Forester:
The 2018 is MUCH better than the 15 I test drove a few weeks ago. Dash has better materials, not quite as noisy inside, you can get a premium trim with all the options for the same price as an outback premium with basically nothing. (Moonroof, power gate, eyesight) Outback does come with heated seats/mirrors as standard. Seats had acceptable level of conmfort, views are fantastic. 2.5 engine is plenty zippy, its just a more fun car IMHO to drive (minus long highway drives). Styling is a matter of opinion I guess, Forester looks more coventional vs Outback.
Cons: You can hear the engine buzz a bit more inside, but its not outragious. The seats, tough to describe- you can say it feels like your sitting on top of it vs in it I guess. The padding is fine, but it doesnt support you very well like the outback does. Little bit wider seats and more lateral support would go a long way to improving the Forester. Door material was thin, my left knee was resting against the door handle area and I could see the plastic flexing in quite a bit.
Back seats dont fold completely flat like the Outback. A/C fan seems noisy when on max compared to the Outback.
Outback had the edge on cargo unless you really need a few extra inches for tall stuff. Seats down on both, its almost the same total volume, but longer stuff would fit in the Outback better.
So while my initial feeling was that the Outback is the better car all around, it just doesnt make sense for my situation. We have my wifes Toyota Sienna for long trips where comfort is primary. The Forester I can just describe as: sporty/fun, simple, well rounded SUV. It has its quirks though, so better to drive it in person before buying, and do yourself a favor and dont rule out the Outback- overall I was very impressed with it. If we didnt have the van I would be getting the Outback as a go anywhere/do anything family hauler. Another thing, the Forester feels taller, but sit in one side by side with an Outback and you realize your actual position in relation to the ground is nearly the same. Roof of the outback is only 1-2 in at most below the forester. The lines of he outback make it look like a wagon, but really its still mostly SUV when you get up close.

Thanks for the input. What is the price comparison on driving off of the lot, not msrp.

I wonder how the Forester would handle off road? Like fairly serious pothole, rut type earthen, mud and rock type terrain. Is it built stout enough if you drove in that type of stuff regularly would it hold up?

Did you look at the crosstrek?

You can get the same percent off msrp on an outback vs forester. Go to realcartips and subaru forums, most people are getting 13% off msrp following that system. I think now is a good time to get an Outback while its still 0% financing up to 63 months. If you were to get a forester I think waiting is a better strategy until they need to dump them in a few months to make way for the big 2019 redesign. Wasnt interested in the crosstrek so didnt take a good look inside, but it isnt big enough for my tastes.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: medic451,

We are on our second Subaru, first was a forester, at 250,000 miles I decided that my wife was due for a new vehicle, ended up wit a outback (could not get a forester with heated seats without a hole in the roof, but you can in the outback) I’m 6’3” and the seats seem fine to me and the wife doesn’t complain. No problems with either, gas mileage not bad, even with out a turbo has enough power for my use, on the interstate I have to be careful not to run too fast i’ll Look down and I will be at 80 without even realizing it. My 2 cents.

In 2005 I bought the wife a new Mazda 3s. Zippy, fun to drive and good on gas. Good bang for the buck. It has 230,000 miles on it, and I've spent very little to keep it going. Two years ago I started looking for a new SUV for her. Knew nothing of the newer SUV's. Took me 9 months with a spreadsheet. We drove and looked at every SUV from 23k to 54k. We thought we'd like the CX-5 and no we didn't like it. Gutless and sounded like it was struggling. We thought the ride would be a lot better. It was disappointing how the Mazda CX-5 just didn't cut it for us. After 9 months of reading on the web, take wife to all dealerships, make a speadsheet of pro, cons, engine size, horsepower, wheel size, turbo (y/n), tank size, gas mileage, etc, etc... The bang for the buck winner was a Subaru Forester XT Touring. After two years, I'd buy the XT again.