quote:

Originally posted by StorminNormin:

Ha! No, I am being good. Although I can do the cream cheese on this diet. I found Keto bagels I can make that are very low carb. Once I make them and if I like them, then they will get slathered with cream cheese from you know where!

If you are making a southern swing in the next few weeks, let me know, please!

quote:

Originally posted by JALLEN:

quote:

Originally posted by StorminNormin:

Ha! No, I am being good. Although I can do the cream cheese on this diet. I found Keto bagels I can make that are very low carb. Once I make them and if I like them, then they will get slathered with cream cheese from you know where!

If you are making a southern swing in the next few weeks, let me know, please!

Nothing pending at the moment, but I will let you know once I do which I am sure won’t be too long.

Intermittent fasts are fairly easy, particularly if you are already keto adapted.

But, has anyone here tried an extended fast? A week? Two weeks? A month? Longer?

Were you medically supervised?

Did you have any issues or problems?

Did you use any electrolyte supplement? Salt? Lite Salt (i.e. half sodium & half potassium)? How about phosphorus? I can't even find a good supplemental source for that one.

Refeeding?

If I could I'd like to keep the thread focused to life changes, and things we all would generally consider "diets."

Fasting for an extended period of time is well outside the purview, and you'll gain back whatever you lose, if you don't make changes in your life after said fast.

morning workout (50-ish years old)

run one mile 6:55

dumbbell bench press w/ 50s / v-crunch / pullups x 10 3 super sets

barbell squat / weighted sit ups x 20 / dumbbell supine lat pulls 3 super sets

machine overhead shoulder press / burpees 8-10 reps / cable tricep extension 3 super sets

I am busted feel good though

get off your butt

---------------------------------

is this MCT oil thing for real?

some info on mct oil...

it has been used as an exogenous (ingested) ketone supplement. i believe you get more ketones supplementing with mct oil than coconut oil (which i guess you could say is also an exogenous ketone supplement). it's half life is only several hours, so you don't get the benefit of ketones produced by ketosis - while on a low carb diet, or a ketogenic diet, or a high fat reduced carb diet - which last as long as you are in ketosis (days, weeks, months, years, the rest of your life).

it has been used on dementia and Alzheimer's disease patients as both are a brain energy problem - parts of the brain become resistant to glucose and they can't take in glucose for energy and die. the brain can also use ketones for energy - up to (i think it was) 75 or 80 percent.

so a low carb diet and subsequent ketosis has shown benefits in treating dementia / Alzheimer's - and so has taking mct oil.

there are other benefits of exogenous ketones / mct oil also, though the complete list escapes me atm.

Can ketones compensate for deteriorating brain glucose uptake during aging? Implications for the risk and treatment of Alzheimer's disease. 3-2016

Recommendations for ICT use in Alzheimer's disease assessment: Monaco CTAD Expert Meeting. 2013

Ketogenic Diet Promising for Mild Alzheimer's Disease 3-31-2018

after the 4 minute mark - brain uses glucose or ketones...

quote:

Originally posted by arcwelder76:
If I could I'd like to keep the thread focused to life changes, and things we all would generally consider "diets."

Fasting for an extended period of time is well outside the purview, and you'll gain back whatever you lose, if you don't make changes in your life after said fast.

Respectfully, this is a complete misunderstanding of what fasting is and how it works. It is not "starvation." Fasting can fit into any "diet", but it most easily fits with LC/HF, keto, NSNG, and the like. Fasting is simple (like not even a challenge) when you are fat-adapted.

Extended fasts serve to lower your body's set weight by bottoming-out your insulin. If you manage coming off an extended fast properly, through diet, you will not gain any weight back. For those that are metabolically broken, fasting and LC/HF "diet" can fix them by lowering their insulin levels and increasing insulin sensitivity.

It's a thing that works for many thousands of people, and it certainly does belong in any discussion of "diet." in 2018.

quote:

Originally posted by g8rforester:

quote:

Originally posted by arcwelder76:
If I could I'd like to keep the thread focused to life changes, and things we all would generally consider "diets."

Fasting for an extended period of time is well outside the purview, and you'll gain back whatever you lose, if you don't make changes in your life after said fast.

Respectfully, this is a complete misunderstanding of what fasting is and how it works. It is not "starvation." Fasting can fit into any "diet", but it most easily fits with LC/HF, keto, NSNG, and the like. Fasting is simple (like not even a challenge) when you are fat-adapted.

Extended fasts serve to lower your body's set weight by bottoming-out your insulin. If you manage coming off an extended fast properly, through diet, you will not gain any weight back. For those that are metabolically broken, fasting and LC/HF "diet" can fix them by lowering their insulin levels and increasing insulin sensitivity.

It's a thing that works for many thousands of people, and it certainly does belong in any discussion of "diet." in 2018.

Uh, where is the word "starvation" in what I said? I was responding to "extended fasts" of weeks or months, and what I said is true. Without changes in ones life outside of that fast, it's not going to be meaningful long term change.

Consider also, that the majority of people reading this thread either simply aren't going to think about long term fasting, and may not be medically fit to do it.

Intermittent fasting, is technically what I've been doing by eating only once a day, and I've already been told I'm killing my brain etc. etc. Did you read the whole thread?

So I started low carb keto diet several weeks ago. It's been a learning curve for sure but at this point I've averaged 3lbs weight loss per week. I'm sure that will probably drop off in the future as the initial weight loss counts less over time. So far I've lost 15 lbs.

Yep life change for real. Since I began this after quitting nicotine, I've felt an added morale boost.

Coconut oil is a mct oil, no need to purchase an oil labeled mct. Probably a lot cheaper too. I always cook with it or I use butter. The refined version has the coconut flavor and smell removed, the unrefined doesn't. I use the unrefined for my coffee and the refined for scrambled eggs. Its all about controlling the hormones Insulin, Leptin and Ghrelin. The last two tells your brain when you are hungry and when you are full. Sugars and processed grains screw all 3 up. High fat foods such as beef, butter, heavy cream, avocados, coconut oil and olive oil(real olive oil, research mislabeled olive oil) controls the 3 hormones and provides satiety.

Also at all cost avoid vegetable and seed oils. Those were developed for industry and for burning in lamps . Highly inflammatory to your body as well as processed sugar and grains. I believe that is the cause of most heart disease, obesity and auto immune disease.

If I add coconut oil to coffee in the morning, I'm typically not hungry until lunch. If I'm tired in the morning, coffee with MCT oil tends to wake me up and help my brain focus for a while. Since switching to keto, that's the closest thing to an energy drink I've found.

quote:

Originally posted by bryan11:
If I add coconut oil to coffee in the morning, I'm typically not hungry until lunch. If I'm tired in the morning, coffee with MCT oil tends to wake me up and help my brain focus for a while. Since switching to keto, that's the closest thing to an energy drink I've found.

I agree. I add butter(Kerrygold from Ireland), as well as coconut oil in equal amounts to my coffee. About a tablespoon of each and then add heavy whipping cream. Way better than any "energy" drink.

quote:

Originally posted by crue-dell:
Coconut oil is a mct oil, no need to purchase an oil labeled mct.

MCTs are a specific component of the coconut oil. I think for general use the coconut oil is better health-wise, but some people like the MCT better if their main goal is energy.

cabbage lasagna. It was an instant hit, even for my parents who are off the boat from Italy and have been in the Italian restaurant business all our lives.

Very filling and 16 net carbs for a huge portion, about 730 calories worth. I mean a big portion...

quote:

Originally posted by Nickelsig229:
cabbage lasagna. It was an instant hit, even for my parents who are off the boat from Italy and have been in the Italian restaurant business all our lives.

Very filling and 16 net carbs for a huge portion, about 730 calories worth. I mean a big portion...

That looks good.

quote:

Originally posted by arcwelder76:

Uh, where is the word "starvation" in what I said? I was responding to "extended fasts" of weeks or months, and what I said is true. Without changes in ones life outside of that fast, it's not going to be meaningful long term change.

Consider also, that the majority of people reading this thread either simply aren't going to think about long term fasting, and may not be medically fit to do it.

Intermittent fasting, is technically what I've been doing by eating only once a day, and I've already been told I'm killing my brain etc. etc. Did you read the whole thread?

Yes, I read the thread.

The self-discipline involved in personal diet management is key in any of this. So if you want to keep the discussion germane, why not focus on that? If you don't have discipline, none of the rest matters.

I mentioned starvation because that is what most people think when they see the word "fasting." You do OMAD, and mentioned IF early on, but you're bagging on extended fasts. That makes no sense.

The principles are identical, whether it's OMAD, 16:8, or extended periods. It's merely how you manage coming off the fast. With OMAD or 16:8, eat normally. With 48+ hour fasts, you need to manage differently.

Extended fasts should be prepared-for by making dietary changes. The after-period can be managed by dietary changes. It's all diet-related. If someone is severely overweight, fasting can heal them, period. Fasting is the ultimate dietary management tool. It takes discipline and research to make it work, just like any "diet."

Professional help is available through the The Intensive Dietary Management Program.

I apologize if I'm being a dick here, but I believe the benefits are too great to not have this as part of the discussion. I'll lay off if you remain unconvinced.

I'll say it again. The goal here is for information that MOST PEOPLE will use to get out there. Most people, will not be fasting for weeks or months.

If you want to start a thread on fasting for weeks and months, go for it.

I'm not interested in being convinced of anything regarding extended fasting, because at no point, will I be fasting for weeks or months, just like MOST PEOPLE.

Drop it.