quote:

Originally posted by jimmy123x:
Nobody on this forum is an EXPERT as to which oil they should run in a car or how long they should go before changing it.

Thank you for pointing this out.

Moderated Status, 30 Days

You are going to cool it or I am going to remove you from this forum permanently. You've been annoying other people but now, you're beginning to piss me off.

And don't bother to post while you're on moderated status, jimmy, because those posts will never see the light of day in this forum. If you continue to post while you're on moderated status, I'm just going to remove you from this forum. Under normal circumstances, I wouldn't feel the need to mention this, but twice recently you've been on moderated status, and both of those times, you continued to submit long posts. When you do that, you're wasting your time and you're annoying the admin.

Figure it out

quote:

Originally posted by bdylan:
I never imagined folks were so passionate about oil.

In the hierarchy of topics that can ignite and fan a flame war of epic proportions, oil falls only slightly behind religion and politics, and it's actually a subset of both.

My position on oil has always been simple: any is better than none.

quote:

Originally posted by jimmy123x:

quote:

Originally posted by Ryanp225:
Synthetic is superior by far. Any leaks or consumption that develops are due to the sludge getting rinsed out.

Not true. Synthetic oil gets past gaskets much easier than traditional oil and causes oil leaks. Sludge does not build up at all with modern Dino oil and it's additives if changed at normal recommended intervals.

OP- I wouldn't do it at this age. There is no reason your truck shouldn't go 200k with Dino oil. The modern additives in oil is much much better than 20 years ago, there is no reason the motor shouldn't do 200k miles on dino oil.

Synthetic oil does not "get past gaskets" easier than Dino oil that is simply not true.

As far as OEMs who write specifications being experts, were they correct when they initially specced 5W30 for a 2000 Honda Accord, or when they back specced 5W20? Sometimes operators are more expert on the conditions they run their equipment than those who wrote the specs.

Well dang, outa town for a day and come back to the oil debate. I bought a used '01 GMC p'up for a great price from an older gent. It had a history of using a bit of oil. I began using a synthetic blend for easier cold winter starts and oil consumption increased for a about a year. It has settled in now, runs cooler. I may go to full synthetic, only because of the evidence of how clean engines are that do. A friends big block looks shiny new with the valve covers off. No sign of the usual dirty brown stuff. Fun thread to read, passion, opinion and some drama

I am not an expert, and after reading a lot of information in this thread, I realize how much I don't know.

However...

I have experienced older vehicles, that had high mileage, swapped to synthetic, and started leaking like crazy.

I have also with my daughters car, swapped to dino from the synthetic she had due to age and mileage, to slow the leaks she had. It has worked.

So, if, according to folks with much more experience than me, this shouldn't happen, why is it? What would cause this?

Thanks in advance, I really am curious, and don't want to believe outdated information, nor pass it on to my kids.

I have used Mobil 1 in every thing since the late 80's. It looked like it increased the gas mileage about 1 percent in the vehicles. At 208K miles, the truck engine was clean as new when I had to replace the valve cover gasket. It was starting to leak for some reason.

It was used in the lawn tractor until recently when it got too expensive since I change the oil every 20 to 25 hours.

The water pump would run about 15 minutes longer on a tank of gas. But it started to leak oil around the low oil indicator at the base of the engine and I had no success in multiply attempts to reseal it with a new gasket. So I went back to using dino oil.

I believe synthetic to have greater lubricity, higher film strength, higher shear strength, lower volatility, and better pourability at lower temperatures than conventional mineral based oil. It also has fewer additives than conventional oil, which starts out as crude and must be refined to a point where it is usable. Contaminants are not completely refined out, so additives like dispersants are used to keep contaminants like parafins in suspension to prevent sludge. We change the oil, less because of contamination from the byproducts of combustion, but more because the additives like detergents and anti-foaming agents as well as dispersants break down rather quickly.

I also understand synthetics have higher natural detergent property that can help loosen existing sludge and varnish deposits. The potential concern that an older engine with many miles that was not maintained well and subsequently is switched to synthetic could experience clogged oil passages within the engine.

The fear that seepage past gaskets increases with synthetics is certainly persistent. Some of my research indicates that some gasket material used decades ago relied on mineral based conventional oil to migrate into the material causing it to swell to create a functional seal. Many believed, depending on the base stock of the synthetic being used, this swelling was not occurring in these older gaskets following a switch. It is also my understanding that these gasket materials have been out of favor in the automotive industry for a very long time.

FWIW, YMMV.

quote:

Originally posted by pepsiblue:

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:

quote:

Originally posted by bdylan:
I never imagined folks were so passionate about oil.

You don't know the half of it:

https://sigforum.com/eve/forums...0601935/m/8280032834

To add to this, check out Bobistheoilguy.com

LOL the oil threads on motorcycle boards in the 90's especially HD board were epic, threads like this went on for ever with folks on each end of the spectrum weighing in with their w-opinions.

There was always a Mr know it all in the mix, actually a couple of them come to think of it.

www.bobistheoilguy.com is truly the go to place for everything petroleum, if you want to learn that industry and the products without attending MIT, it's the place to go for information.

You gotta appreciate a board where the led article on oil is by a user named MolaKule...

2008 Colorado 4 cylinder used mostly for transportation here. Roughly 125,000 miles on it. After retiring my driving dropped drastically, and I didn't feel good about leaving the dino oil in it for 6 months to a year for about 3000-3500 miles. I switched to full synthetic and change about every 3500 miles which works out to about 10 or 12 months. This is working for me; you know your vehicle and driving so you have more than enough opinions here to decide your plan. The only advice I would swear by is change your oil and filter when you've had the engine up to operating temp for at least 20 minutes. All the crud in it should be in suspension and come out when you drain it. Good luck.

This thread delivers, on all fronts.

Jimmy's posts get the usual TL,DR.

I know a few very knowledgeable racers and mechanics that would agree synthetic oils are superior, especially for hard use and long durations between maintenance.

Just a small bit of personal experience. I was a small engine guy for a couple of years. Dudes would bring me a 1964-1990 whatever for a tune up. And demand synthetic oil. I'd ask if the engine has ever been rebuilt, of course not. Then advise them that you do not want to run synthetic in a well worn engine that has never had synthetic oil in it.

"Your full of shit, just change the oil and put synthetic in it."

Ok.

Ive had SEVERAL people bring back their shit after I fully advised them not to run synthetic in it. The engine rings are shot and synthetic oil smokes non-stop in old engines... like a mosquito fogger. People say it ran fine before, and then I worked on it, and now it smokes like crazy. And are all pissed off.

I make them watch me change the oil, back to conventional oil that their engine has used for decades. And magically, like I recommended, their machine stops smoking and works perfect.

I am a huge synthetic oil fan. Considering the cost difference between conventional and synthetic is often as little as $5, why not. I use it in every new engine I own. I'll use it in a moderately worn engine. I will not use it in a 30 year old engine. Or an engine with 200K miles on it that has used conventional oil its entire life.

That being said, the best quality about synthetic is its cold use properties. If its arctic cold where you live, you probably should use synthetic. If its not, then it really doesn't matter.

quote:

Originally posted by sigcrazy7:
I’m always amused at how much thought goes into what oil to run, then that same person will slap on the shittyist Fram oil filter.

Fram makes a good filter. In fact, they make perhaps the nicest off the shelf filter you can buy under $15. The "Fram filters are garbage" routine was fun while it lasted, but they make a great product.

One last thing, the follow the manual, those guys are pros and they designed your car thing...

Almost every new car comes with 0W20 oil. Some new cars even come with 0W16 oil. Did the auto manufactures suddenly realize that super thin lubes are the ticket to engine longevity? NO! They are under intense scrutiny to increase their Corporate Average Fuel Economy standards (CAFE). If using 0W20 oil can net them a 0.4 mpg boost in fuel efficiency, then that's 400 pounds of weight that they don't have to cut out of the car to achieve the same fuel mileage.

If the manual was written by an engine engineer, he is likely to recommend a 0W30 or 0W40 for most cars. But since the manual is written by penny pinchers at the behest of gov bureaucrats, we get stuck with 0W20 oil recommendations.

Basically, these new super thin oils are NOT what is best for your engine. They are there because some govt bureaucrat decided to implement increasingly difficult to obtain fuel standards on the auto makers.

When your new car sold in America uses one oil, and the same new car sold everywhere else in the world, recommends a different (thicker) oil, we call that a clue.

I'm not a huge fan of 0W20 oil. And I honestly believe that 0W30 or 5W30 will give you a longer engine life (unless operated in arctic conditions normally).

quote:

Originally posted by HRK:
LOL the oil threads on motorcycle boards in the 90's especially HD board were epic, threads like this went on for ever with folks on each end of the spectrum weighing in with their w-opinions.

The same thing happens on the BMW moto boards as well. People pay upwards of $20k for a toy, then want to run the cheapest oil they can find, or want to out guess the manual.

On many of the metric motorcycle boards, they resoundingly recommend Rotella 15W40. It meets the spec, and its cheap.