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Moderator
Picture of arcwelder76
posted
Hello, fellow SIGforum members,

I'd just like to weigh in on asking a specific member for help, and asking for help in general:

Feel free to ask a specific member for help with whatever you'd believe they'd be helpful with. They are, however, under no obligation to respond.

When someone, anyone, asks for help, we're all under KNOW obligation to respond.

Get it?

If you don't know, don't guess. That's not help, that's obfuscation.

If you have no direct knowledge or experience with the topic, let people who actually have first hand experience answer.

Did the topic drop like a stone, and no one has responded for quite a while? OK, perhaps it's time for some brainstorming.

We are all presumably good natured and eager to help one another. Part of that, should be not muddying the waters of a pursuit of knowledge.


Arc.
______________________________

"Like a bitter weed, I'm a bad seed"- Johnny Cash

"I'm a loner, Dottie. A rebel." - Pee Wee Herman

Rode hard, put away wet. RIP JHM

"You're a junkyard dog." - Lupe Flores. RIP

 
Posts: 24743 | Location: Love that dirty water, oh | Registered: June 09, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Once a Marine,
always a Marine
Picture of Ronin1069
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There is a well known member here who left the forum for that very reason. And then when he would offer the advice he was solicited for, members would come into the thread and tell the OP why the requested advice was wrong. He stopped coming here for that very reason.

No announcement, no fan fare, just stopped.

Thanks for posting this Arc.


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All it takes...is all you got.
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For those who have fought for it, Freedom has a flavor the protected will never know

ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
 
Posts: 9556 | Location: Belly of the Beast | Registered: January 02, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Moderator
Picture of arcwelder76
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An example, but this isn't limited to the lounge.

If someone is asking a question about firearms, and you don't know the answer, then you don't need to pitch in.

Are they asking simply for an opinion? Then that is different. Everyone has an opinion.

If you lack expertise in a topic, please pump the brakes.


Arc.
______________________________

"Like a bitter weed, I'm a bad seed"- Johnny Cash

"I'm a loner, Dottie. A rebel." - Pee Wee Herman

Rode hard, put away wet. RIP JHM

"You're a junkyard dog." - Lupe Flores. RIP

 
Posts: 24743 | Location: Love that dirty water, oh | Registered: June 09, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Nullus Anxietas
Picture of ensigmatic
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by arcwelder76:
When someone, anyone, asks for help, we're all under KNOW obligation to respond.

ITYM "NO?" Smile

quote:
Originally posted by arcwelder76:
If you don't know, don't guess. That's not help, that's obfuscation.

If you have no direct knowledge or experience with the topic, let people who actually have first hand experience answer.

I've at least a couple times formulated an answer in response to such requests and realized "I don't know any more than the member asking" and dumped it--for that very reason.




"America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system,,,, but too early to shoot the bastards." -- Claire Wolfe
"Whenever somebody uses 'liberal,' when what they really mean is 'leftist,' they immediately lose my attention." -- Me
 
Posts: 14067 | Location: S.E. Michigan | Registered: January 06, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
Just to add...when someone has a problem or asks for help/advice why are some members compelled to post something that they think is clever but has absolutely nothing to do with the OP's question/problem?

Example being the well worn "that'll buff right out." Really, all it does is trivialize the OP's request and make the member look a bit stupid as well.


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I wouldn't let anyone do to me what I've done to myself
 
Posts: 866 | Location: NoVa | Registered: March 14, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Moderator
Picture of arcwelder76
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by RogB:
Just to add...when someone has a problem or asks for help/advice why are some members compelled to post something that they think is clever but has absolutely nothing to do with the OP's question/problem?

Example being the well worn "that'll buff right out." Really, all it does is trivialize the OP's request and make the member look a bit stupid as well.


Unless the OP is asking about how to cure his Wife's Mother's Dog of cancerous AIDS, I'd say that such comments are harmless attempts at humor, they can be tolerated. The gravity of a question should indicate whether humor is in order.

You are overruled.


Arc.
______________________________

"Like a bitter weed, I'm a bad seed"- Johnny Cash

"I'm a loner, Dottie. A rebel." - Pee Wee Herman

Rode hard, put away wet. RIP JHM

"You're a junkyard dog." - Lupe Flores. RIP

 
Posts: 24743 | Location: Love that dirty water, oh | Registered: June 09, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Moderator
Picture of arcwelder76
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If you're going to post when a member is asking for help.

Do you have experience?

What is it?

Is it valuable to the topic at hand?

You have one job, to help.

Do your job.


Arc.
______________________________

"Like a bitter weed, I'm a bad seed"- Johnny Cash

"I'm a loner, Dottie. A rebel." - Pee Wee Herman

Rode hard, put away wet. RIP JHM

"You're a junkyard dog." - Lupe Flores. RIP

 
Posts: 24743 | Location: Love that dirty water, oh | Registered: June 09, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici
Picture of ChuckFinley
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I generally don't answer these threads anymore, even when it is something that I am a national level expert in. There are just enough posters who are that unique blend of anti-intellectual/know-it-all to make it not worth the grief and challenge back that inevitably comes from one of a few members.

I'm sorry that this means I don't help in as many situations as I might, but if it is something critically important and the OP has an email I'll get in touch out of the forum sometimes...




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"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." -- C.S. Lewis
 
Posts: 4616 | Location: District 12 | Registered: June 16, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Moderator
Picture of arcwelder76
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quote:
Originally posted by ChuckFinley:
I generally don't answer these threads anymore, even when it is something that I am a national level expert in. There are just enough posters who are that unique blend of anti-intellectual/know-it-all to make it not worth the grief and challenge back that inevitably comes from one of a few members.

I'm sorry that this means I don't help in as many situations as I might, but if it is something critically important and the OP has an email I'll get in touch out of the forum sometimes...


Having to wade through that sort of thing, is part of what I'd like to cut down on. All in the interest of such threads actually being of use to the OP, and the rest of us.


Arc.
______________________________

"Like a bitter weed, I'm a bad seed"- Johnny Cash

"I'm a loner, Dottie. A rebel." - Pee Wee Herman

Rode hard, put away wet. RIP JHM

"You're a junkyard dog." - Lupe Flores. RIP

 
Posts: 24743 | Location: Love that dirty water, oh | Registered: June 09, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Nullus Anxietas
Picture of ensigmatic
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by ChuckFinley:
I generally don't answer these threads anymore, even when it is something that I am a national level expert in. There are just enough posters who are that unique blend of anti-intellectual/know-it-all to make it not worth the grief and challenge back that inevitably comes from one of a few members.

*shrug* I get that. We all do. I don't let it stop me from trying to help. The one or two that have been egregious in this respect I've simply put on "ignore."




"America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system,,,, but too early to shoot the bastards." -- Claire Wolfe
"Whenever somebody uses 'liberal,' when what they really mean is 'leftist,' they immediately lose my attention." -- Me
 
Posts: 14067 | Location: S.E. Michigan | Registered: January 06, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
His Royal Hiney
Picture of Rey HRH
posted Hide Post
I agree. As someone who is ignorant on more topics than knowledgeable, I go through help threads to learn what to do, not just someone’s wild ass guess that they don’t bother disclosing is a wild ass guess.

I understand expert opinions may differ but swags (Scientific Wild Ass Guesses) should be avoided as there are a good number of real experts in Sigforum on any number of topics.



"It did not really matter what we expected from life, but rather what life expected from us. We needed to stop asking about the meaning of life, and instead to think of ourselves as those who were being questioned by life – daily and hourly. Our answer must consist not in talk and meditation, but in right action and in right conduct. Life ultimately means taking the responsibility to find the right answer to its problems and to fulfill the tasks which it constantly sets for each individual." Viktor Frankl, Man's Search for Meaning, 1946.
 
Posts: 14890 | Location: Bay Area, CA | Registered: March 24, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
always with a hat or sunscreen
Picture of bald1
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Ronin1069:
There is a well known member here who left the forum for that very reason. And then when he would offer the advice he was solicited for, members would come into the thread and tell the OP why the requested advice was wrong. He stopped coming here for that very reason.

No announcement, no fan fare, just stopped.


Appliance Brad was extremely generous with his help. I know I benefited from him via emails which I very much appreciated. He hasn't been active since last November which I personally consider a huge loss for this forum.

Arc thanks for starting this thread. Folks need to understand the consequences of their actions.



Certifiable member of the gun toting, septuagenarian, bucket list workin', crazed retiree, bald is beautiful club!
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Posts: 8697 | Location: Black Hills of South Dakota | Registered: June 20, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
is circumspective
Picture of vinnybass
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by ensigmatic:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by arcwelder76:
When someone, anyone, asks for help, we're all under KNOW obligation to respond.

ITYM "NO?" Smile

I thought he meant "know" intentionally. As in, if you don't KNOW, you're under NO obligation to respond with obfuscating opinions & maybes on the matter.
 
Posts: 4200 | Location: Las Vegas, NV. | Registered: May 30, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
His diet consists of black
coffee, and sarcasm.
Picture of egregore
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Ronin1069:
There is a well known member here who left the forum for that very reason. And then when he would offer the advice he was solicited for, members would come into the thread and tell the OP why the requested advice was wrong. He stopped coming here for that very reason.


We don't know that, but I think it very likely. I'd get annoyed too.

I am personally happy to respond to "paging egregore" posts and private e-mail communications, but remember who's doing who the favor. It is not to be taken for granted or overused/abused. (No one has, and the exchanges I have had have always been positive.)

This message has been edited. Last edited by: egregore,
 
Posts: 20836 | Location: Johnson City/Elizabethton, TN | Registered: April 28, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of arcwelder76
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Lots of things can dissuade a member. I don't think it was a major factor. He did garner a high number of these threads though.


Arc.
______________________________

"Like a bitter weed, I'm a bad seed"- Johnny Cash

"I'm a loner, Dottie. A rebel." - Pee Wee Herman

Rode hard, put away wet. RIP JHM

"You're a junkyard dog." - Lupe Flores. RIP

 
Posts: 24743 | Location: Love that dirty water, oh | Registered: June 09, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Peace through
superior firepower
Picture of parabellum
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Ronin1069:
There is a well known member here who left the forum for that very reason. And then when he would offer the advice he was solicited for, members would come into the thread and tell the OP why the requested advice was wrong. He stopped coming here for that very reason.

No announcement, no fan fare, just stopped.
What in the world are you talking about? Who are you talking about? Be specific. Name, please.
 
Posts: 84038 | Registered: January 20, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Once a Marine,
always a Marine
Picture of Ronin1069
posted Hide Post
Sorry Para. It’s his story to tell.


___________________________
All it takes...is all you got.
____________________________
For those who have fought for it, Freedom has a flavor the protected will never know

ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
 
Posts: 9556 | Location: Belly of the Beast | Registered: January 02, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of YellowJacket
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If you want to ask a specific member a question, maybe you should just email them. IMO, posting to the open forum is opening yourself up for comment.

But I do agree that if one doesn't know what he's talking about, he should be quiet. But that's a pretty general human rule.



"The frost on the ground probably envies the frost on the trees."
 
Posts: 8487 | Location: Marietta, GA | Registered: February 10, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Peace through
superior firepower
Picture of parabellum
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Ronin1069:
Sorry Para. It’s his story to tell.
Then what are you doing even mentioning this? And how can he "tell his story" if he's gone?

If you feel that you cannot mention names, you need to not mention it at all.


____________________________________________________

If a politician found he had cannibals among his constituents, he would promise them missionaries for dinner. - H. L. Mencken
 
Posts: 84038 | Registered: January 20, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Once a Marine,
always a Marine
Picture of Ronin1069
posted Hide Post
quote:
If you feel that you cannot mention names, you need to not mention it at all.

I cannot argue with that. Won't do it again.


___________________________
All it takes...is all you got.
____________________________
For those who have fought for it, Freedom has a flavor the protected will never know

ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
 
Posts: 9556 | Location: Belly of the Beast | Registered: January 02, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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