SIGforum.com Main Page The Lounge Why does it seem like European cars are so unreliable and high maintenance?
Main Page The Lounge Why does it seem like European cars are so unreliable and high maintenance?Go | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
Republican in training |
In case any of you missed it - ConsumerReports rates Audi, BMW, Porsche, and Subaru as the top luxury brands in quality/reliability. -------------------- I like Sigs and HK's, and maybe Glocks | |||
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| Leave the gun. Take the cannoli. |
Audi and BMW?  And Subaru has their share of engine problems. Porsche does have quality figured out and it's reflected in the resale vales. | |||
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fugitive from reality |
Subaru's problems are with the new 2.0 motor. The 2.5 was bullet proof. _____________________________ 'I'm pretty fly for a white guy'. | |||
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| Crusty old curmudgeon  |
The same report ranked Kia at #6. That beats out a boat load of big name brands. My 2011 Sorento has 56k on it with zero issues. Go figure. ________________________ "If you can't be a good example, then you'll have to be a horrible warning" -Catherine Aird | |||
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Legalize the Constitution |
Subaru is considered a luxury brand?!? _______________________________________________________ despite them | |||
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| Middle children of history  |
James gets it. I also have multiple vehicles. I really like German cars, but not being required to replace my daily driver with a brand new one every 3 years just to keep it reliable helps free me up for lots of other fun toys. Daily driver: 2003 Lexus IS300 w/170k miles and still running like a champ. 100% reliable, never had a single thing break. Excellent 2JZ GTE inline-6 engine from the Supra, still more fun to drive than a comparable 3-series, doesn't cost me anything to keep driving it. Weekend toy: Porsche 993 custom single turbo beast with lots of mods. Inspiring? Yes.   | |||
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Member |
Someone actually still reads Consumer Reports? For automotive ratings? __________________________________ An operator is someone who picks up the phone when I dial 0. | |||
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| Member |
Had several BMWs. Followed up by several Infinitis. I like my Infinitis "infinitely" better.  My first BMW 325ci had a brake problem on the first on-ramp to the highway after I picked it up from the dealer. Fun to drive, but costly to maintain (and I had some maintenance issues). My 2010 G37xS had been rock-solid for 127,000 miles. More reliable than than my 323 BMW, more power, includes AWD, and costs less to purchase and to maintain. Plus, for service, they come to my office, pick it up, and leave a loaner. BMW refused to do that. | |||
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| Yew got a spider on yo head  |
The old (2002-2005) 2.0 turbos were solid. 2.5s suffer from continuous oil starvation issues, especially 08 and later. | |||
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Member |
I guess you're not old enough to remember American cars that were designed to rust out and fall apart - even if they were assembled properly... What was the old formula? The dealership would make 40% on the original sale and 60% on maintenance/repair? We can largely thank the Japanese for changing that. I think it's safe to say that English cars deserve their reputation and French cars are mostly lemons  but most of the German, Italian and Swedish cars were well built, quality machines and let's face it - the quality and reliability of almost all automobiles has improved dramatically in the last 30 or 40 years.I've owned 6 Chevy's, a Ford, and a '02 Nissan Pathfinder (great vehicle) - most were pre-owned. One or two were lovingly cared for - most were "rode hard and put up wet" which I suspect had something to do with maintenance/reliability. My wife leased a Cadillac Catera when we got married. When the lease was up we test drove Audi's, Mercede's, Lexus's, Toyota's, Caddy's and the BMW. It was no contest. The BMW was too much fun to drive. We're on our second 3 Series. The first was a 2002 E46. Leased it/loved it. Purchased the second - a 2006 E90. Normal maintenance, no major problems. Both were actually made in Germany... Just my 2 cents. | |||
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Caribou gorn |
'twas my thought, as well. I'm gonna vote for the funniest frog with the loudest croak on the highest log. | |||
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Member |
I have a 2013 BMW 550i, I love the car...very well built IMO. Was hard for me to get used to the oil changes every 12,000 miles. I usually don't go that long. Want to upgrade to a M5 in a couple years. | |||
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| Rock Paper Scissors Lizard Spock  |
WOW!!! Nice 993!!!James in Denver
---------------------------- "Voldemorte himself created his worst enemy, just as tyrants everywhere do! Have you any idea how much tyrants fear the people they oppress? All of them realize that, one day, amongst their many victims, there is sure to be one who rises against them and strikes back!" Book 6 - Ch 23 | |||
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| fugitive from reality |
I did a Google on Subaru 2.5 oil starvation and came up with two pages of oil starvation in turbo motors, but nothing on non turbo units. Mine uses almost no oil between changes. _____________________________ 'I'm pretty fly for a white guy'. | |||
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Member |
It doesn't "seem" like; they are. At least according to Consumer Reports. — Pissed off beats scared every time… - Frank Castle | |||
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At Jacob's Well |
Aside from anecdotes from friends, my only experience with European cars is two separate rentals of new BMW 3-series sedans in the last 18 months. Pros: Both were amazingly fun to drive. The performance, handling, and ride were beyond what I'm used to, and the gas mileage was pretty decent too. Cons: One of the two dropped me into "limp mode" while pulling away from a stop sign. I was accelerating a little faster than I would in my car, but by no means was I driving aggressively. The whole car started shaking, lights started flashing on the dash, and power was cut in half. Had it happened merging onto a busy interstate, it could have had potentially serious consequences. Shutting the car off for a few hours and letting the electronics reset fixed the problem. Granted that's a small sample size, but a 50% failure rate is enough to cool my enthusiasm for German engineering. J Rak Chazak Amats | |||
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Member |
I was going to mention Porsche... Back in the late 90's they adopted the Toyota method of manufacturing ( I forget what it was called) and it saved the company. I have had a couple of Porsches one of which had over 100K miles of track use on it before we rebuilt the engine. That is a testament to quality engineering. We also ahve a Boxster S and that car is one of the best handling cars on the planet and relatively easy to work on if you are so inclined. ------------------ Eddie Our Founding Fathers were men who understood that the right thing is not necessarily the written thing. -kkina | |||
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| Member |
Just in time manufacturing. ------------- The sadder but wiser girl for me. | |||
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| Leave the gun. Take the cannoli. |
Are you thinking of the work of Dr. W. Edwards Deming? He was the American who was credited for turning Japan into the quality control powerhouse that it has become. I believe Toyota was the first to utilize his principles. | |||
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| Member |
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wik...ta_Production_System ------------- The Toyota Production System (TPS) is an integrated socio-technical system, developed by Toyota, that comprises its management philosophy and practices. The TPS organizes manufacturing and logistics for the automobile manufacturer, including interaction with suppliers and customers. The system is a major precursor of the more generic "lean manufacturing". Taiichi Ohno and Eiji Toyoda, Japanese industrial engineers, developed the system between 1948 and 1975.[1] Originally called "just-in-time production", it builds on the approach created by the founder of Toyota, Sakichi Toyoda, his son Kiichiro Toyoda, and the engineer Taiichi Ohno. The principles underlying the TPS are embodied in The Toyota Way. ------------------ Eddie Our Founding Fathers were men who understood that the right thing is not necessarily the written thing. -kkina | |||
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SIGforum.com Main Page The Lounge Why does it seem like European cars are so unreliable and high maintenance?
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