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"Member"
Picture of cas
posted
Wow, just venting.. pardon the pun. Up at my grandfathers hunting cabin, years ago I installed a "draft induction fan" in the kerosene stove exhaust. The pipe goes up from the stove, through a wall, across a room, then up the chimney, so it obliviously doesn't draw well. When the wind blows from the north, the stove will puff back in a loud, shocking "whoomph!" that scares the shit out of you and fills the place with fumes.

The draft fans helps with that. I installed it about 15 years ago, it wasn't cheap, a unit made by Tjernlund. I was there this weekend and for some reason the speed controller stopped working (worked last month, but not this month. I love it when things break when they're not in use) Anywho... long story shorter, I just tried to order the part. Tjernlund website lists the part, but no price. I didn't really feel like calling. Search the web, Hmmm... Grainger wants $115.00 lol, sure Grainger, they're crazy with everything, this is a stupid lille rheostat. No way. Okay, search some more, err.. Tjernlund wants $69.00 on Amazon. Eek For a little rheostat? Lets see, it's made by BK Electronics.. search some more. $14.95 shipped, from them, also via Amazon. "Click"

I understand a company having some mark up, but good grief, that's nuts. Thank goodness for the internet I guess, in old days I'd been stuck getting been stuck.


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Sliced bread, the greatest thing since the 1911.

 
Posts: 16637 | Location: 18th & Fairfax  | Registered: May 17, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
On the DL
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BOHICA



A mind is a terrible thing.
 
Posts: 20330 | Location: Central Florida (near Orlando) | Registered: January 03, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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A local HVAC contractor wanted $150 to install a start/run capacitor on my dead unit. I purchased a replacement from another HVAC contractor, delivered, for $45. Later, having seen the cap box, I went to the local contractor store and found them for $8. I stock two of them now. Makes me feel better to have two on hand just in case.

It is hard for me to understand how business charge so much for HVAC repair components and work. Think of UBER. A ride from one location to another books at $15-30. Let's say your HVAC truck would cost $30 to get to my house. 30 minutes of labor to open up the HVAC box and replace a component -- say $1 per minute? An $8 part -- your inventory carrying cost might actually be two years at 6%, or another $1 of "interest." Let's say it's $70 all told. Charge me $100 and you're making >40% gross profit. Double your cost, and I can't afford it. So, you lose the opportunity for $30, while I spend $8 plus some gas money to and from the store.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: 4MUL8R,


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Posts: 3147 | Location: Commonwealth of Virginia | Registered: January 15, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of a1abdj
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quote:
Let's say your HVAC truck would cost $30 to get to my house.


Let's say you're 30 miles away each way. 60 miles total, 10 MPG, 6 gallons at $3.00 a gallon. So far we're at $18 and haven't even figured in the cost of the truck ($50,000 to $100,000), the cost to equip the truck (tens of thousands), insurance, maintenance, repairs, etc.

I have a truck that doesn't even start and move for less than $125 because it's loosing money if it does.


quote:
30 minutes of labor to open up the HVAC box and replace a component -- say $1 per minute?


Plus the drive to your job, plus the drive away from your job. And in addition to the hourly rate there are the additional taxes, insurance, training, etc, etc, etc that is attached to the cost of an employee.

quote:
Charge me $100 and you're making >40% gross profit.


Or making $10, or loosing money.

I have found that most people really have no clue how much operating a business costs, and feels that they're getting screwed when in fact that's not necessarily the case.


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Posts: 13566 | Location: St. Charles, MO, USA | Registered: September 22, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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A few years back, I was in Tampa, FL working as an HVAC mechanic. I worked for a design / build firm, so mostly industrial install stuff, though I've always worked service.

My hourly pay was $37.50 (well above normal for that area), which means w/ tools, van, insurance, etc. as posted above my burden rate to the contractor was around $70.00 an hour.

I haven't done residential work in 20 years or more but have seen pretty high markups on parts. I always chalked it up to owner perogative as I was assuming no risk other than personal injury due to inattention. Owner was carrying the risk for profitability.



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Posts: 1407 | Location: Fort Lauderdale, FL - its a dry heat....... | Registered: January 26, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by soflaac:
A few years back, I was in Tampa, FL working as an HVAC mechanic. I worked for a design / build firm, so mostly industrial install stuff, though I've always worked service.

My hourly pay was $37.50 (well above normal for that area), which means w/ tools, van, insurance, etc. as posted above my burden rate to the contractor was around $70.00 an hour.

I haven't done residential work in 20 years or more but have seen pretty high markups on parts. I always chalked it up to owner perogative as I was assuming no risk other than personal injury due to inattention. Owner was carrying the risk for profitability.


Yup, and you were getting paid for 8 hours a day. So if you drove 30 minutes to one job, only billed an hour, 30 to the next and only billed an hour......all day.....you'd get paid for 8 hours, but the shop would only be billing out 5 or 6 hours. So that shop labor rate went way down.

I'm in business also.....people simply don't understand. From the time I leave my house until the time I get home, I am working. I'm not driving a $65k truck around in circles all day because I am bored.

I have one small tackle box, it's about 8" deep x 12" wide, by 12" high and in it alone are $1000 in just marine electrical connectors......why, I stock all of them so I'm not wasting my customers time and money to drive 45 minutes round trip to buy 1 connector to finish a project. I have $500 in AWAB premium S/S hose clamps and on and on.
 
Posts: 17244 | Registered: June 12, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Similar to OP. A relay blew on my dryer. Cheapest parts place wanted ~$45 for the part. Looked closer at the relay, it had the relay part number on it. I figured, what the hell, and check Mouser, $4.50 for the exact same part.
 
Posts: 595 | Location: North East Jersey | Registered: August 16, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Most people forget about the 15-20% tax/benefit overhead on the wages and the criminals at wcf and G/L insurance.



Hannibal ad portas. Carthago delenda est.
 
Posts: 5999 | Location: Utah | Registered: December 18, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of V-Tail
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Did I read this correctly, or did I miss something?

I believe that the OP (cas) was referring to the cost of the part for self-install, but many people are going on and on about the cost of running a business with a technician to do the install, the cost of operating vehicles, etc. None of the preceding, just the cost of the part, is what I believe this thread was started for.



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Posts: 20330 | Location: Central Florida (near Orlando) | Registered: January 03, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
quarter MOA visionary
Picture of smschulz
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quote:
I understand a company having some mark up, but good grief, that's nuts.


So how do you know what their cost is, let alone their mark up? Confused

But hey if the BK part is the same or the same for your needs vs the Tjernlund part then you made the right decision for you.

Nothing really to get worked up about, IMO.
 
Posts: 16607 | Location: Houston, TX | Registered: June 11, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by V-Tail:
Did I read this correctly, or did I miss something?


Mayhaps a tiny bit of thread drift, not unlike this very comment. Wink



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Posts: 1407 | Location: Fort Lauderdale, FL - its a dry heat....... | Registered: January 26, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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People have no concept of the cost of running a business. I work in a moderate size gun shop, with a handful of employees. We need to see $3500.00 every day we are open to keep the doors open. A service company with trucks, a shop, employees, insurance, background checks on the employees.....it costs a lot. When I hired security officers it cost several thousand dollars to hire each employee. So immoral doesn't really enter into the equation.
 
Posts: 14647 | Location: Lexington, KY | Registered: October 15, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Had the AC go out several years ago, and I know pretty much nothing about them. Contractor who installed it in the house came out, found the capacitor was dead (showed me how to tell from the swelling on the cap), and showed me how to fix it myself if it happened again - apparently pretty common problem. I ordered 2 of them to have on hand (two sizes for my units). Yes, they were cheap and easy to fix, but I couldn't have done it myself without his expertise, and the AC was totally dead without it. Simple problem and fix, and I gladly paid the price he charged ($140 IIRC). His education of me as a customer earned my repeat business and I have used him for a couple other projects. Of course, having the capacitors on hand, I have never had another failed in the past 6 or 7 years...
 
Posts: 1887 | Location: NC | Registered: January 01, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of cas
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quote:
Originally posted by smschulz:


So how do you know what their cost is, let alone their mark up? Confused


The BK part is the very part in the Tjernlund unit. That's how I knew who made it.


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Posts: 16637 | Location: 18th & Fairfax  | Registered: May 17, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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There is a general point here that applies to a lot of situations - without all the facts you can draw a conclusion that's not accurate or fair.
 
Posts: 37 | Location: New Jersey  | Registered: May 03, 2019Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Your time is cheaper than theirs.

In general electronic manufacturing is 4X parts.

They might have stocked the part for 15 years to support the product Because they couldn't guarantee availability in the future?

Finally- It's a business.


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Posts: 11589 | Location: Bottom of Lake Washington | Registered: March 06, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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They might have stocked the part for 15 years to support the product Because they couldn't guarantee availability in the future?


Or they stocked 10, sold 2 & the other 8 were thrown away 15 years later! What then was the cost of the 2?


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Posts: 3570 | Location: Nashville, Tennessee | Registered: December 16, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by a1abdj:
quote:
Let's say your HVAC truck would cost $30 to get to my house.


Let's say you're 30 miles away each way. 60 miles total, 10 MPG, 6 gallons at $3.00 a gallon. So far we're at $18 and haven't even figured in the cost of the truck ($50,000 to $100,000), the cost to equip the truck (tens of thousands), insurance, maintenance, repairs, etc.

I have a truck that doesn't even start and move for less than $125 because it's loosing money if it does.


quote:
30 minutes of labor to open up the HVAC box and replace a component -- say $1 per minute?


Plus the drive to your job, plus the drive away from your job. And in addition to the hourly rate there are the additional taxes, insurance, training, etc, etc, etc that is attached to the cost of an employee.

quote:
Charge me $100 and you're making >40% gross profit.


Or making $10, or loosing money.

I have found that most people really have no clue how much operating a business costs, and feels that they're getting screwed when in fact that's not necessarily the case.


No, your only cost is the cost of the part. Wink




The fish is mute, expressionless. The fish doesn't think because the fish knows everything.
 
Posts: 47558 | Location: Texas | Registered: February 10, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I hope that Tjernlund , buying in bulk, today or 15 years ago, got a better price from BK than I did buying a single unit. Tjernlund is still making and selling the fan today.


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Sliced bread, the greatest thing since the 1911.

 
Posts: 16637 | Location: 18th & Fairfax  | Registered: May 17, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
In the yahd, not too
fah from the cah
Picture of ryan81986
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I used to work at RadioShack back before the house of cards started to collapse. Their computer inventory system used to tell you what every item cost RadioShack themselves. For non-RS items the markup wasn't huge, maybe 10-20% over cost. But for RS manufactured items it was crazy. A $6 pack of AA batteries cost something like $0.12 to manufacture.




 
Posts: 5666 | Location: Metro West, MA | Registered: March 28, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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