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Rail-less
and
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Gustofer:
quote:
Originally posted by jljones:
So, your bitch is the cop was going 7 over? Really? Are you in the third grade? I got caught eating glue, but Billy didn't eat all of his vegetables?

The internet NEVER fails to cease to amaze me.

The law is the law though correct? Or, does it depend on the individual cop? Are there exceptions? Why shouldn't he get a ticket as well?

If I'm required to not go over the speed limit, why shouldn't you be?

Around here, it is illegal for emergency vehicles (cops/ambulances) to exceed the speed limit even when running code. Yet, they/we do it all the time. Should they/we get tickets?

A couple years back, I was called in emergently to intubate a guy in the ER in respiratory failure. The PA who was on was unable to do so and they called me. I live 8 minutes away on dry roads. I rolled through town doing 70+ while trying to get there before the guy died. An MHP asshole (sorry FN...there are some out there) lit me up several hundred yards before the hospital. I didn't stop for him.

He followed me in to the ER and confirmed that I had been called in and what it was for. He then left, only to show up at my home three days later with tickets for speeding and failure to stop for him.

They were thrown out by the judge and a rather nasty letter was written to his sergeant for making me go through the trouble.

My point is, where is the line? Is it, I can speed but you can't? Is it 10 over? Is it when you are subjectively unsafe? Is it wherever you say it is at any given moment?

If I were the OP, I would without question bring it to the attention of the judge and the officer's sergeant...after I paid the ticket. But then, I'm kind of an asshole that way. Wink

18 over is a bit much to get any sympathy unless you've got a good reason to do so though. Go big or go home right? Big Grin


An ER was only staffed by a PA?


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Use thumb-size bullets to create fist-size holes.
 
Posts: 12816 | Location: Charlotte, NC | Registered: May 07, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Staring back
from the abyss
Picture of Gustofer
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Dusty78:

An ER was only staffed by a PA?

At night...yep.

Rural America.


________________________________________________________

"How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy." Winston Churchill
 
Posts: 15368 | Location: Montana | Registered: November 01, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of sourdough44
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I’m on a pretty good run, over ten years without being stopped. I drive a ‘gray-man’ vehicle and move with the traffic flow.

I suppose my dash cam is a deterrent too(just kidding on that).
 
Posts: 3525 | Location: WI | Registered: February 29, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of RR
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quote:
Originally posted by cparktd:
Going with the flow.

I had a 100 mile a day commute for over a decade on a very busy interstate and often saw LEO speeding and appreciated it... but they also routinely allowed 10 over by everyone else unless they were acting stupid like lots of lane changes or tailgating. If a LEO drove strictly the posted speed it would could cause mile long backups because no one would pass.


^^^^^this
And in some states emergency vehicles are exempt from vehicle and traffic law
 
Posts: 55 | Location: Upstate NY | Registered: October 09, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post
paradox in a box
Picture of frayedends
posted Hide Post
I have never once in my life seen a Massachusetts State Trooper travel under the speed limit of his own free will. If traffic forces it then he has no choice. But generally if you are in the left lane and only 10 over the limit they will ride your ass until you move. I support the police and I’ve not gotten a ticket in like 15 years. But the hypocrisy of any of them giving speeding tickets for going like 80 in a 65 is annoying.




These go to eleven.
 
Posts: 9765 | Location: Lancaster, MA | Registered: November 14, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici
Picture of ChuckFinley
posted Hide Post
"And yes, it's ok for him to say you were speed while he was doing 7 over. Only time I've heard of people getting pulled for <9 over is when the limit is 25, 35, or a school zone."

Then you haven't driven US 60 from Frankfort to Versailles. Woodford county LE write this up all the time, as little as 3 over in a 55.




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"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." -- C.S. Lewis
 
Posts: 4692 | Location: District 12 | Registered: June 16, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Oh stewardess,
I speak jive.
Picture of 46and2
posted Hide Post
Having habitual rule breakers enforcing the rules is one of the most vile human creations.

There ought to be a law.

Oh, wait.
 
Posts: 23212 | Registered: March 12, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by rizzle:
Just seems odd to me, I would think if they were writing a ticket, that they would not be over the limit themselves. He spent a little over an half hour with me, he wasn't going to a call.


Yes they will usually drive over the limit as to not create a bottle neck of traffic behind them. Here in Florida they don’t write speeding tickets 99% of the time unless you’re doing over 10 mph above the speeding ticket.
 
Posts: 16578 | Registered: June 12, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Do No Harm,
Do Know Harm
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by rizzle:
First ticket in over thirty years for me, That's OK, I was and deserved it.
My bitch is when he showed me the radar speed in his car, he was going 62 in a 55 (opposite direction across a four lane). Is it common for them, taking moving radar and speeding themselves at the same time?


Yes.

I recommend you point this out to the judge when you go to court. Or perhaps the assistant district attorney, and suggest to them that they drop it due to this fact.




Knowing what one is talking about is widely admired but not strictly required here.

Although sometimes distracting, there is often a certain entertainment value to this easy standard.
-JALLEN

"All I need is a WAR ON DRUGS reference and I got myself a police thread BINGO." -jljones
 
Posts: 10144 | Location: NC | Registered: August 16, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of sigcrazy7
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Here in Utah, an officer is allowed to speed even without lights on while in the course of doing his job, such as nabbing you. Therefore, the fact that he was speeding is completely irrelevant to your guilt.

The logic of the law is to allow the officer to get closer to the speeding vehicle before alerting the perp so as to lessen the desire to run.



Hannibal ad portas. Carthago delenda est.
 
Posts: 5744 | Location: Utah | Registered: December 18, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by sigcrazy7:
Here in Utah, an officer is allowed to speed even without lights on while in the course of doing his job, such as nabbing you. Therefore, the fact that he was speeding is completely irrelevant to your guilt.

The logic of the law is to allow the officer to get closer to the speeding vehicle before alerting the perp so as to lessen the desire to run.


I'm not sure how that applies in this case with the officer initially going the other direction when radar indicated the speeding event. He'd want to be going slower as to be in a better position to turn around and catch the op. Faster makes turning around take at least marginally longer.


-------------
$
 
Posts: 7407 | Location: Midland county, MI, United Socialist States of Amerika | Registered: February 17, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Sigforum K9 handler
Picture of jljones
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by the_sandman_454:
quote:
Originally posted by sigcrazy7:
Here in Utah, an officer is allowed to speed even without lights on while in the course of doing his job, such as nabbing you. Therefore, the fact that he was speeding is completely irrelevant to your guilt.

The logic of the law is to allow the officer to get closer to the speeding vehicle before alerting the perp so as to lessen the desire to run.


I'm not sure how that applies in this case with the officer initially going the other direction when radar indicated the speeding event. He'd want to be going slower as to be in a better position to turn around and catch the op. Faster makes turning around take at least marginally longer.


Ummm, no.

I know facts, logic and experience generally aren't welcome in these threads, but that is completely not true. There are a LOT of reasons to speed up.

A lot of know it alls get shredded in court. That's the reason that attorney's generally won't "fight" the ticket. They plead it down to something else like Improper Equipment instead. A lot of people think they know, but they don't.

There's a little thing called visual estimation that is one of the key indices of speed enforcement. Usually the first contact with the car is the visual. The officer observes the car for a period, usually 300' if possible. During that time, he already knows the approximate speed of the vehicle. The radar is just the verification of the visual estimation. And in some states, the court document.

Based upon the first second or two of the visual, I am already adjusting my speed to position to make the stop. Depending if I am cutting the median, and need momentum, or if I am going to hit a turn around or drive way, I am going to accelerate. Sometimes A LOT.


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Posts: 32070 | Location: Logical | Registered: September 12, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by rizzle:
18 over, but my point is it's still ok for him to be in court saying I was speeding, when he was too.


Yes. He's allowed to speed. You're not.

Think about it. His job isn't to maintain the posted speed, while enforcing others doing the same; his job is to enforce. In order to move beyond the surrounding vehicles, moving faster than the posted speed is a physical necessity.

The posted speed is not a "limit," legally speaking, despite what the sign says. While Montana and a few other places famously post "reasonable and prudent" as the "limit," the basis of a speed limit is that it's what's been determined reasonable and prudent for a particular stretch of road, curve, etc. You may also be cited well beneath that speed, if conditions dictate, and you may also be given some latitude above that. Commonly you'll also be given some latitude above for spedometer variance, too (5 mph). This should never be assumed.

The officer enforcing that law has discretion, both in enforcing the law, and in observing it. This is true of many aspects of law enforcement. There are many jurisdictions in which you may not open carry, but the officer must. You may not lie to the police officer; he may lie to you to elicit information. You are required to observe and adhere to posted speeds (or less, as conditions require), while the officer observes departmental policy regarding speed.

You'll find little defense in "but he was doing it too." He was doing his job. You were breaking the law. Do you understand the difference?
 
Posts: 2702 | Registered: September 13, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Technically Adaptive
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I did not realize he was allowed to speed coming the other direction to enforce the law. I understand now.
 
Posts: 482 | Location: Willcox, AZ | Registered: September 24, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Ignored facts
still exist
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by chongosuerte:
quote:
Originally posted by rizzle:
First ticket in over thirty years for me, That's OK, I was and deserved it.
My bitch is when he showed me the radar speed in his car, he was going 62 in a 55 (opposite direction across a four lane). Is it common for them, taking moving radar and speeding themselves at the same time?


Yes.

I recommend you point this out to the judge when you go to court. Or perhaps the assistant district attorney, and suggest to them that they drop it due to this fact.


Inquire about a "Citizen's arrest." Then arrest the cop. Tit for tat. Wink


.
 
Posts: 7271 | Location: Sunset Highway MP37, then turn South | Registered: February 28, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Technically Adaptive
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As I said previously, I don't intend to get the charges dropped.
The principal of getting charged with speeding while he was speeding (other direction), is it common?, considered normal?
I would of thought no, but I was wrong.
 
Posts: 482 | Location: Willcox, AZ | Registered: September 24, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Staring back
from the abyss
Picture of Gustofer
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by sns3guppy:
While Montana and a few other places famously post "reasonable and prudent" as the "limit,"

That changed years ago. We have posted limits that are enforced, or not.

It seems it's up to the individual cop and whether or not his wife put out last night.


________________________________________________________

"How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy." Winston Churchill
 
Posts: 15368 | Location: Montana | Registered: November 01, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Go ahead punk, make my day
posted Hide Post
Follow the cop around with a camera until he spits on the sidewalk or jaywalks.

Then he can join the boy scouts that turn themselves in for such egregious offenses of the law.
 
Posts: 40288 | Registered: July 12, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of sigcrazy7
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Having established that the police can speed in the performance of their duties, keep in mind that they don’t have carte blanche to disregard the speed limits. I’m reminded of an instance back in the 1990’s when I was in the National Guard. My platoon had three different cops from two different jurisdictions. Apparently, a local cop was speeding in his marked patrol car, just headed to work or something trivial. I can’t remember exactly. In that city was a UHP sub station, and a nearby trooper pulled him over and issued a ticket. This, naturally, let to an arms race of sorts when the locals began pulling over every UHP officer they could find to issue citations. Eventually big brass got involved, a cease fire was ordered, and nobody showed up to court.

More recently, my brother, who is a FBI special agent, transferred to a new duty station. Shortly before he got there, there was a big bru-ha-ha over a particular agent who felt the need to run lights everyday on the way home. Eventually this attracted the attention of the local jurisdiction, and you can imagine the rest. Chief of police and FBI station chief had a meeting of the minds, so to speak. The agent is no longer there, and the station now has very strict rules about the use of lights and sirens in Bureau vehicles.



Hannibal ad portas. Carthago delenda est.
 
Posts: 5744 | Location: Utah | Registered: December 18, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by rizzle:
I did not realize he was allowed to speed coming the other direction to enforce the law. I understand now.


No, you don't, and your'e still whining about it.

You broke the law. You got caught. Deal with it.
 
Posts: 2702 | Registered: September 13, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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