quote:

It's not some exclusive "club" handshake thing.

Yeah, actually... it is.

You can put your hand up in front of your face if you want, nobody can stop you... but it isn't a salute and you don't rate giving one.

quote:

If I want to pay respect to returning military vets, a salute would not be inappropriate.

Yes, it would. Next you'll say that you could wear a uniform around if you wanted.

Rendering a salute implies that it is returned, a salute goes both ways and shows respect both ways. By saluting a veteran or active service member you are initiating an exchange of respect that you haven't earned.

You're claiming a right and an honor you don't deserve.

The fact that you don't understand what salutes are and what they mean proves the point.

quote:

Yeah, actually... it is.

You are exactly right tanksoldier. (But you knew that, didn't you?) In fact, for those who may not know, Military personnel who find themselves in the stockade, lose their privilege of saluting.

Who cares? I think there are bigger things besides his little photo-ops that he is doing that we should worry about.

quote:

Originally posted by flesheatingvirus:
Who cares? I think there are bigger things he is doing that we should worry about.

This is truth!

quote:

Originally posted by tanksoldier:
The fact that you don't understand what salutes are and what they mean proves the point.

sa⋅lute
  /səˈlut/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [suh-loot]

–verb (used with object)
1. Military. to pay respect to or honor by some formal act, as by raising the right hand to the side of the headgear, presenting arms, firing cannon, dipping colors, etc.
2. to address with expressions of goodwill, respect, etc.; greet.
3. to make a bow or other gesture to, as in greeting, farewell, or respect.
4. to express respect or praise for; honor; commend.

–verb (used without object)
5. Military. to give a salute.
6. to perform a salutation.

–noun
7. Military.
a. the special act of respect paid in saluting.
b. the position of the hand or rifle in saluting: at the salute.
8. an act of saluting; salutation.
9. a gold coin, bearing the image of the Virgin Mary receiving Gabriel's salutation, issued by Charles VI of France and by Henry V and Henry VI of England.

Your definition proves Tanks point (which is 100% correct).

Saluting is between military members. So if you want to salute them, I recommend the giving them Gold coins - I'm sure they would appreciate it!

Yes, the salute in the picture is "picture perfect", however just the thought of that clown saluting just makes me want to throw up.

quote:

sa⋅lute
  /səˈlut/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [suh-loot]

Just shows how clueless you are.

Clue one: The dictionary isn't always right.
Clue two: Don't try to explain military protocol to a career NCO.

We aren't talking about complimenting someone or giving applause, we're talking about a military hand salute... known in the military as "presenting arms".

The military salute is about an EXCHANGE of respect and acknowledgment of obligation up AND down the ranks.

Note that it IS acceptable for military personnel to salute civilians if they are so inclined. Effectively the military person is telling the civilian: "I'm showing you respect even tho you can't really return it."

A civilian initiating a salute with a service member is in effect demanding respect from the service member.

I mean, really. Do you think you have a better understanding of what a military salute is and means than those of us who have served? Really?

quote:

Originally posted by RHINOWSO:
Your definition proves Tanks point (which is 100% correct).

Saluting is between military members. So if you want to salute them, I recommend the giving them Gold coins - I'm sure they would appreciate it!

Actually, the definition does not require that the salute be between military members. Look at definition #4, for example.

quote:

Originally posted by tanksoldier:
Just shows how clueless you are.

Take it easy, I'm simply engaging in conversation. Are you trying to inform me or beat me down?

quote:

Clue one: The dictionary isn't always right.
Clue two: Don't try to explain military protocol to a career NCO.

1.) True, it is not, but it is certainly helpful when trying to understand the meaning of words.

2.) Please don't misunderstand me; I know your background from reading your posts on this forum and I would not presume to lecture you on military protocol. I am trying to have an informative discussion.

quote:

We aren't talking about complimenting someone or giving applause, we're talking about a military hand salute... known in the military as "presenting arms".

The military salute is about an EXCHANGE of respect and acknowledgment of obligation up AND down the ranks.

Note that it IS acceptable for military personnel to salute civilians if they are so inclined. Effectively the military person is telling the civilian: "I'm showing you respect even tho you can't really return it."

I disagree...I think that civilians certainly can show respect to military members.

quote:

A civilian initiating a salute with a service member is in effect demanding respect from the service member.

No demand. A civilian initiating a salute may, in fact, simply be showing respect to the service member without expecting anything in return.

quote:

I mean, really. Do you think you have a better understanding of what a military salute is and means than those of us who have served? Really?

Please do not patronize me. We can have an informative discussion without sinking to that level.

quote:

Originally posted by nathab2:

quote:

Originally posted by RHINOWSO:
Your definition proves Tanks point (which is 100% correct).

Saluting is between military members. So if you want to salute them, I recommend the giving them Gold coins - I'm sure they would appreciate it!

Actually, the definition does not require that the salute be between military members. Look at definition #4, for example.

The POTUS is the Comander-in-Chief of the military and should salute. He has the right by his postition.
Civilians who haven't served don't have the right to salute.
Military members who didn't serve with honor don't have the right to salute.
It's something you have to earn.

quote:

Originally posted by nathab2:

quote:

Originally posted by RHINOWSO:
Your definition proves Tanks point (which is 100% correct).

Saluting is between military members. So if you want to salute them, I recommend the giving them Gold coins - I'm sure they would appreciate it!

Actually, the definition does not require that the salute be between military members. Look at definition #4, for example.

You realize that not all of the things in your definition are talking about the military practice of raising your hand in a specific manner to your head, right? And some of your highlights are specifically denoted for military (1, 7A). 2 is about talking to someone, 3 is about bowing... 4 is a general definition, not the military act of saluting.

Not to mention, as Tank Soldier states, just because you looked it up in the dictionary doesn't mean it's correct or what the military uses as standards.

quote:

Originally posted by Snake207:

quote:

To his credit though, at least his salute is "more correct" than the active duty guy next to him.

It's funny...that was the first thing I noticed. I was thinking that O's salute was actually pretty good looking for someone who has never served.

I'll give him credit for at least making the effort to give a proper salute, for whatever that's worth.

At least he didn't look like this idiot who DID serve...

Snake,

That is exactly what I was thinking when I saw Obama's salute.

I don't like Obama, but he does deserve credit for doing a proper salute as Commander-in-Chief at a very somber time.

Yes, it was obviously a staged photo op and a very well staged one at that. But that's the breaks of the game in politics. Landing on an aircraft carrier with a sign that says, "Mission Accomplished" is also a photo op.

quote:

Originally posted by PASig:
Ironically, his salute is better executed than the Major General right next to him.

Very true. Let's give him some creadit for being there in these special ceremonial returns from roughly midnight until 5 AM.

Besides, look across the entire line of that group shot that derived from. There's all sorts of bad saluting.

I honestly can't believe that the man appears @ this special event & you choose to bash his salute, basically appearance.

Come on!

quote:

Originally posted by Broadside:

I don't like Obama, but he does deserve credit for doing a proper salute as Commander-in-Chief at a very somber time.

I did lots of practice in the mirror when repeating his mantra: I'm Good Enough, I'm Smart Enough, and Doggone It, People Like Me!

quote:

Originally posted by PASig:

quote:

Mr. Obama's predecessor, President George W. Bush, visited the families of hundreds of fallen soldiers but did not attend any military funerals or go to Dover to receive the coffins. In a 2006 interview with the military newspaper "Stars and Stripes," Mr. Bush said he felt the appropriate way to show his respect was to meet with family members in private.

Agreed 1000%

I find it sickening that Obama would use the caskets of our dead soldiers and Marines as props in a photo op!

His dithering on the whole Afghanistan issue is precisely why more of these caskets are arriving at Dover than ever before!

link

The parents or significant others OK'd the use of their loved ones remains/caskets. Food for thought.

quote:

Originally posted by RHINOWSO:
You realize that not all of the things in your definition are talking about the military practice of raising your hand in a specific manner to your head, right?

Of course, but what I'm getting at is that the "military practice of raising your hand in a specific manner to your head" is a mark of respect for the person to whom one is saluting.

You gentlemen seem to be saying that noone outside the military can give respect to military members in that fashion. Your idea, RHINOWSO, of giving the gold coin is a good one for showing respect, but ultimately what is the difference? Both are ways of showing respect.

quote:

Originally posted by S_SIG_S:

quote:

Originally posted by PASig:
Ironically, his salute is better executed than the Major General right next to him.

Very true. Let's give him some creadit for being there in these special ceremonial returns from roughly midnight until 5 AM.

Besides, look across the entire line of that group shot that derived from. There's all sorts of bad saluting.

I honestly can't believe that the man appears @ this special event & you choose to bash his salute, basically appearance.

Come on!

This is nothing more than a photo op, to show his "concern" all the while he farts around on making a decision on Afghanistan. Either go large like GEN McCrystal asked for, or get us the hell out of there!

Memo to the Prez: Shit, or get off the pot already!

quote:

Originally posted by Arty:
Civilians who haven't served don't have the right to salute.
Military members who didn't serve with honor don't have the right to salute.
It's something you have to earn.

Wait...you have to earn the right to show respect to military members?