I have read a little bit on the internet and am not thrilled about Hawaii gun laws.
I will be travelling for a 7 day vacation to Turtle Bay in the near future and figured with LEOSA, I'd be good to go. Now I'm not so sure.
Anybody here know Hawaii's laws and how big of a hassle it will be?
I did a quick google search and it seems like it is fine as long as you fill out some forms with HPD. However like everything on the internet take this with a grain of salt. Supposedly we aren't suppose to have 30 round ar15 magazines here however shops sell them. Also take what the police tell you with a grain of salt too. I've had on several occasions been given incorrect information. I don't think it was intentional just ignorance on the officers part. Have you reached out to HPD? http://www.honolulupd.org/info...dex.php?page=gunmain
|Fighting the good fight|
This section would be the one I would be concerned about...
II. If you are not on official duty with your governmental law
enforcement agency and you are carrying a concealed firearm
pursuant to 18 U.S.C. § 926B, you are not considered a “law
enforcement officer” in the State of Hawaii. The Hawaii Revised
Statutes will be applied to you as if you were a “civilian” with no law
It is my understanding that New York tried similar restrictions, basically disqualifying those carrying under LEOSA/HR218. There was an opinion rendered that the law was valid IN ALL STATES, and NY was required to allow carry under that law. However, ammunition and magazine capacity restrictions, such as those in New York, New Jersey and California etc would have to be followed. I may have some more information somewhere I can dig for, but you should be able to find it.
Welcome to the Divided States of America. It will only get worse as more liberal states test the limits of what they can get away with.
|The Quiet Man|
Be very familiar with the LEOSA restrictions on where you can not carry. The State law is more restrictive, and I'd make every effort to stay within it, but the Federal law DOES trump state law on this issue and case law supports it. I'd not want to be the most recent test case on this point though.
There are still some questions about LEOSA at the State level. It was clearly written to supersede all State law (and this has been supported by the Courts) but some States (NJ in particular) argue that while it authorizes the WEAPON it does nothing to supersede state law on ammunition or magazine capacity. There is an ongoing effort in Congress to clear this up.
My policy, and this is purely my policy and in no way constitutes legal advice, is when I travel to restricted states I carry a weapon approved by my department that meets their magazine restrictions (p365 with 10 round magazines, j frame if it's somewhere REALLY restrictive), carry department issued ammunition, avoid going to areas where I reasonably know a weapon would be prohibited, and do nothing to draw attention to myself. If stopped I'd be exceptionally polite, identify myself and my agency, apologize for any misunderstanding, and hope for the best. The law is actually on your side, but if you annoy local LE they can seriously inconvenience you until it gets cleared up.
I'll be 100% honest. If I were planning a stay at Turtle Bay and didn't intend to do any trips off the resort property I probably wouldn't carry. I'd store the weapon in it's lock box in the room safe (There will almost certainly be one) and only get it out when I was going somewhere off property. That's what I (hypothetically) do at Disney at least. I can almost guarantee that Turtle Bay will have its own restrictions on carrying firearms that would be problematic under LEOSA if local LE wanted to make an issue of it.
When I made my first trip to CA I called ahead to the agency and got a feel for how they did business and their attitude on the matter. It boiled down to "got a badge? Don't wander down the street flashing a pistol and don't shoot anyone unless you REALLY have to." I consider that sound advice regardless of location.
Honestly the only place I've been where I had even a hint of an issue was flying out of Albuquerque NM. I walked up to the terminal and told them that I was LE and had an unloaded firearm in my baggage to declare and they went in to full panic mode until the manager came over. Funny thing was I was in town for a school and there were at least 20 other officers, all carrying weapons, in line with me.
I'll be following this thread with interest. Oahu is on my list of places I'd like to see.
How times have changed. Many years ago when I was still active LE, my wife and I took a trip to HI. We were leaving on a flight to another island and I watched my checked luggage going through the x-ray machine.
When the guy saw my pistol I thought he'd have a fit so I explained I was active LE on vacation. He said he didn't care about guns, he was looking for some kind of prohibited fruit.
I travel nationwide quite a bit (not Hawaii yet) and I've never had an issue carrying under LEOSA. I do not pay much attention to the State laws other than the restricted areas. Some may say that is foolish but I'll take my chances in a court of law should the need arise. The law was enacted for Officer safety and my safety is more important than a State trying to trump up their authority.
|Sigforum K9 handler|
This I agree with a small modification. In CA, I usually roll with 10 round magazines. Why poke the bear, especially with TSA going through my stuff on the way out the door.
"It's a bold strategy, Cotton. Let's see if it works out for them"
Thanks for the replies. I planned on following all local laws, I just want sure on some of the registration regulations. I will be there for 6 full days and leaving early on the 7th day. It says that I have to register if I am staying longer than 6 days, so I figured I would forego that process. I have my carry gun narrowed down to a p365 or G43, so the mag restrictions wont be an issue. Outside of the place we are staying, I think we have some hiking planned and a trip to Pearl Harbor. Ill have to do some more research on PH and their rules, but Id bet I wont like what I find.
I have reached out to a few LEOs from Hawaii, but havent received a response. Ill let you know if I hear anything.
These liberal states really make me mad. I am a proponent of constitutional carry, and dont think that anyone should have to jump through hoops to carry. I just dont get how LEOSA can be ignored on the state level, and it not have been addressed and fixed by now.
|Each post crafted from |
rich Corinthian leather
On a separate note, enjoy Turtle Bay (though this is perhaps not your first trip there specifically or to HI in general). We went to Turtle Bay for our first HI trip based on recommendations from here on SIGforum and were quite pleased.
"The sea was angry that day, my friends - like an old man trying to send back soup in a deli." - George Costanza
I'm interested as to how this turned out. I carry under retired LEOSA creds,along with a MN state permit when I want to be super secret squirrel
LEOSA is written for all 50 states. Hawaii is part of the US and must abide by LEOSA. The part about.....unless you are on official duty......is bull crap.
So is having to fill out any type of paperwork, etc. None of this is required by LEOSA.
Hawaii and NJ need to be spanked.....hard....for trying to apply their own laws.
"The Marines I have seen around the world have, the cleanest bodies, the filthiest minds, the highest morale, and the lowest morals of any group of animals I have ever seen. Thank God for the United States Marine Corps." Eleanor Roosevelt, 1945
While I fully agree, nothing stops a local from messing with an out of stater and making a mess of vacation and dragging you through a legal morass for following a federal law.
As a former resident of New York this was a common occurrence with those traveling through NY under Fopa
|Do---or do not. |
There is no try.
Frankly, Hawaii is the last place I'd go. They're basically hostile to out-of-state police.
I do have to make a comment or two...
My one suggestion to all folk going to the islands... make it two weeks... especially if traveling from the East Coast... takes a day to get there and a day to get back...
This was an interesting discussion in that it was all about LEO's past and present being able to carry.... as is usual y'all get a pass because of being current or past guberment employees as in contrast to us regular lowly peons.... but with that said and out of the way:
Thank you all for your service, I do respect and admire you all for doing a job I never could. I do also admire our congress for passing a law that freed you all up to carry everywhere, sort of kind of maybe... just wish they could actually read and understand our constitution.
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