I had a quick question about this. If you buy a firearm for someone else, as a gift, does this violate the line?

I.E.: A parent buys a pistol for their kid, but its remains in the parent's name until the kid is 21.

I'm asking because I'd like to get something for my girlfriend later in the year.

No, if you are buying the gun with your money for the purpose as giving it as a gift, it isn't a straw purchase.

A straw purchase is you buying for the other person (with their money or for profit) so they can evade the check process.

"In their name?" No guns are in any persons name in my state (except for stuff requiring tax stamps). And the line in the for asks something along the lines of if you are the "actual buyer." If you are buying it for a gift then you are the buyer.

Gifting is legal, but I can't cite an exception in the code. A straw purchase entails intent and collaboration on the part of the purchaser and the person they are purchasing it for. There is no exchange of money or anything of value by the person receiving the gift, unless your girlfriend is really cool which also removes it from being a straw purchase.

Thanks, the wording that is used is very vague regarding that kind of situation.

The purchaser (or gifter) does a background check, not the owner/holder (giftee) of the gun.

When you fill out your forms, read the first yes/no question. It is about the buyer, not the possessor.

From the ATF website (www.atf.gov):

(B14) May a parent or guardian purchase firearms or ammunition as a gift for a juvenile (less than 18 years of age)? [Back]

Yes. However, possession of handguns by juveniles (less than 18 years of age) is generally unlawful. Juveniles generally may only receive and possess handguns with the written permission of a parent or guardian for limited purposes, e.g., employment, ranching, farming, target practice or hunting.

[18 U.S.C. 922(x)]

Here's the skinny, when you give a gun as a gift, YOU ARE the actual buyer of the firearm. Even though you are giving it away as a gift, you purchased the gun with your money without someone else's direction. If you buy the gun for someone else, use their money, or are immediately reimbursed, then you are NOT the buyer of the firearm. Whether or not the person you are buying the gun for is prohibited or not DOES NOT MATTER. If you are buying the gun for someone else, then you are NOT the actual buyer and you have violated Title 18 USC Section 922(a)(6), that is you have falsified a federal document during the purchase of a firearm. But just to recap, it is perfectly legal for you to actually buy a firearm for the purpose of giving it to your girlfriend as a gift. Your money, no reimbursement, no problem.

Lots of you are saying with no reimbursement. Now what if you just trade gifts? Like say you give a gun to your friend who gives you a pricey golf club? No intent of circumventing law, collaborating, or tin foil hats, but like at Christmas?

I've purchased and gifted two firearms.

The first was a limited release handgun that I had originally purchased for myself, but after owning it for a year and a half I decided to make a gift of it to a family member.

The second firearm was a rifle I specifically purchased as a Christmas gift for my father. I mentioned that I was buying the rifle for my father to the sales person behind the counter and they didn't bat an eye. The sales person and I struck up a conversation while they scoped the rifle for me and conducted my background check. At one point the sales person mentioned how they had actually called the police to arrest a couple of their customers who attempted to buy firearms from them illegally; so I felt fairly confident that they didn't consider my buying the rifle for my father as an illegal action.

So let's say your purchase a new weapon, and then decide either you don't like it, or you don't have the funds to pay for it and then want to sell it.

How long do you have to wait for it not to be a violation of the law? Assuming you really did that, and that the person you sold to you did so legally.

Kevin

Q: Kid (under 21) gives money to one of their parents to purchase a pistol for the house for self defense. The kid directs the parent to what would suit the needs of the household. The pistol remains the parents' until the kid is 21 and can legally take possession of it.

Is this a borderline situation of the law?

This message has been edited. Last edited by: EMitch,

quote:

Originally posted by EMitch:
Q: Kid (under 21) gives money to one of their parents to purchase a pistol for the house for self defense. The kid directs the parent to what would suit the needs of the household. The pistol remains the parents' until the kid is 21 and can legally take possession of it.

Is this a boarder lining situation of the law?

I am not a lawyer and I'd be interested to hear from some of the legal experts on the forum regarding this...

...but my instinct is that this is almost the text book description of a "straw" sale. Someone who is not currently legal to own a handgun hands money to someone else to buy them a gun using the legally qualified adult's name and background record. I suspect it might be difficult for LE to discover a crime like this but if it were detected I would bet that, at a minimum, the adult would be in some serious trouble and quite possibly the minor as well.

I think I forgot to mention it...the kid is still living in the same house as the parents. It would be a family firearm.

quote:

Originally posted by EMitch:
I think I forgot to mention it...the kid is still living in the same house as the parents. It would be a family firearm.

IMO the legal address of the criminals wouldn't have any bearing on the illegality of the action...other than it might make it more difficult for LE to detect the crime.

I didn't read all the posts, sorry if this is a repeat.

1. I think part of the "don't lie..." is also that you can't buy a gun (with your money or thier money) if it is going to go to a person that would not otherwise qualify for gun ownership.

2. There is a huge amount of confusion in the market by FFLs. I was looking to buy a gun for my brother - one said they would not let me buy a gun then ship it to my brother. The gun would have gone to an FFL in the state where my brother lives. Other FFLs said it was fine. (I ended up buying the gun, taking possession and having a gunsmith look it over before I sent it to his FFL.) In this area the ATF are good - you can call and get the correct answer.

2. Remember to take a look at state laws....

As an example, if I remember correctly, in North Carolina the person receiving a pistol as a gift must have a pistol permit (or ccw). I think the only exception is a transfer at death (via estate).

quote:

Originally posted by 911Boss:
No, if you are buying the gun with your money for the purpose as giving it as a gift, it isn't a straw purchase.

A straw purchase is you buying for the other person (with their money or for profit) so they can evade the check process.

So how does the recipient of the "gift" evade the check process?